limp-wristed autistic

Remember kids, radfems aren’t feminists, they’re either Christian fundamentalists roleplaying a facade of second wave gender essentialism or idiots who bought their bullshit and don’t realize their only political allies are white supremacists.

Well that was fast, it took like ten minutes for a terf to get upset about this post. But if you’d really like some sources sweetie, here ya go! xoxo get well and out of that cult soon :)

And a two hour video essay on the subject :)))

do u remember when the wider feminist position on gendered sport was that we should abolish it, and that women's accomplishments can be measured side by side (& indeed, neck and neck) with men's? what the fuck happened to that? (*whispering* i know what happened. it was the terf movement.)

literally no feminist ever argued for the abolishment of sex segregation in sports. do you people just think sexual dimorphism isn't real or

Not every sport selects for high testosterone. Some sports have been segregated because when they were mixed women beat men. We also know by now that "sexual dymorphism" isn't actually the main determinant factor for success in sports, money is. And the fact that women always get the short end of the stick when it comes to access to training facilities, finance, and even investigation into what training methods work best, is not a biological issue but rather a systemic social one. Hope this helps.

We absolutely did argue to end sex segregation in sports! I still argue that! It was the popular take on here for a long time! There should be a skill and segregation not a sex based one

And before you say "but then women would never win" the reason we have sex segregation in sports is because men got upset when women beat them. Which happened when they were allowed to compete directly

Not every time but that's because no one wins everytime

But this is something feminists argued for for a long time

Yeah as someone who was there I can confirm abolishing gender segregation in sports was The Feminist Stance for years and it ONLY switched when TERFs and radfems decided to take "women are weaker than men" and make it ~progressive~ so they can keep their rancid racism, transphobia, and intersexism train going. Growing up I remember arguing with my step-dad over this very topic in like 2005. If you went back to the mid-aughts and insisted to a room full of feminists that we have to keep women's sports separate because men have biological advantages over us poor weak females you'd get labeled a conservative and promptly shown the door. If they were feeling kind that day, anyway.

The idea that "gender segregated sports are good actually" is VERY NEW and you should never forget that it's a massive step backwards that goes against everything feminisim was building towards. The argument was very much "women are just as good and often BETTER than men at sports and the only reason we're kept separate is because the patriarchy knows that and wants to deny us power and acclaim" and we should really go back to that for everyone's sake. Like Katie Ledecky is so good she can't even practice around the guys because she destroys their self-confidence, we do not need separate categories for men and women. All it does it make women's sports get viewed and treated as lesser in every conceivable way so a bunch of rich, misogynistic dudes don't have to worry about their players losing motivation when a girl beats them at the only thing they're good at.

Anyway fuck TERFs, SWERFs, and radfems, I'm sick of seeing things that were like basic feminist stances(mixed gender sports, free the nipple) being rewritten for the sake of bitter neo-conservative cis perisex white women who wouldn't know an actual progressive talking point if it punched them in the fucking face.

It's wild that "men are wonderful and actually deserve love" has become controversial and cutting edge feminism but we gotta fight the radfems somehow.

Like, do they really not get that "men are all violent and dangerous" is the patriarchy talking, and that making women fear men benefits the patriarchy and harms feminism? Do they not get how they're upholding toxic masculinity?

@letitrainathousandflames don't hide this in the tags:

ID: screenshot of tags reading, "yeah / no i don't want a 'women's exclusive wagon' in the subway; i want gropers and harassers to be held accountable / instead of having a policy that says that all men are potential threats and we can't have them near us / these alleged feminist policies are just ~boys will be boys~ repackaged in a 'girl power' 'feminist' box / actual men will be regular people and the so-called ~boys~ should be held accountable for their actions"

To add on here for some UK flavoured context- in the UK Margaret Thatcher introduced the infamous Section 28- a law that forbade the ‘promotion of homosexuality’ - which basically means schools couldn’t mention LGBTQ+ topics and LGBTQ+ advocacy groups were threatened with prosecution. Thatcher was *famously* very buddy buddy with Reagan and both in the UK and US at least, the pair did their best to ignore the AIDS crisis. 

“ So we end up with a bunch of young queer folks teaching each other queer history based on what random scraps they could find from the Internet.” - also this is really succinct and exactly what we’re all depending on rn because there’s basically no alternative except rebuilding and becoming those elders for queer people in the future. 

And may I recommend onearchives.org as a reputable source for queer history education? Their mission is preserving the stories of queer people so while it’s not the same as talking directly to queer elders, it is the stories.

Also the comment on the trans inclusive branch is explicitly why equating ALL radfems to TERFs is not accurate. Most visible ones are TERFs, but including trans people (aka TIRFs) does not stop it from being radical feminism either. Also just because you are accepting and actively supportive of trans people, or are even trans yourself, Does Not mean you are not a radical feminist and it Does Not mean your brand of (potentially unpacked/unnoticed) radfem rhetoric is suddenly the Good kind. All of radical feminism hurts the queer community enmasse. There is no one who gets by it unscathed. And the trans inclusive radical feminist point of view is still very harmful to trans people enmasse.

You don’t have to consider yourself a radfem, letalone a TERF, to still be mimicking and outright scripting from radfem talking points. Please learn what it is, and do your part in unlearning whatever pieces of it you have picked up unknowingly or purposefully. It is never too late.

Simple bits to start with questioning and asking others about are:

- The idea that All Men are Evil (this hurts literally everyone, even cis women who hear this and can end up too afraid to enjoy life for long periods of time, and this is actually a notion that has been used to pull people into cults. Letalone anyone who is not a perisex cis woman that gets targeted for this and the violence is then ‘rationalized’ with this notion)

- Testosterone is the evil/violent/overly sexual horomone (even when you personally claim that trans women on HRT are exempt from this view, it still hurts them, non-HRT women, cis men, trans men, trans folks on T that aren’t men, all intersex people w hormonal imbalances, and yes even cis women bc this is a misogynistic point used as to why Women On Period Are Insane Bc Higher Testosterone. Testosterone is neutral and so is estrogen)

- Women’s love for other women is Better or More Special than any other loving dynamic (even when this includes mspec and trans women. Not to be confused with celebrating the special specifics of WLW dynamics. It’s the emphasis on inherent Betterness or More Healthy than any other dynamics that is the one to look out for. WLW dynamics are beautiful and special, but there is no one dynamic inherently better than any other one)

- Certain queer orientations have privilege over others (it’s all lateral)

- Anyone with a beard is safer in the world (… Please think about anyone who isn’t a cis man who has a beard and why that may actually put them in more danger, especially dependant on any of their other features)

- Some trans genders have more privilege than others because of how cis genders work in society (being trans is a different playing field, it is again all lateral)

- Only women can ever really be healers and teachers

- Anything that equates all positive human traits to femininity only and equates all negative human traits to masculinity only

- Only addressing toxic masculinity and never naming nor addressing toxic femininity

- Anything trying harder to seperate men’s and women’s gay communities rather than help understand and respect each other

- Anything that pits mono orientations (hetero/homo) against mspec orientations (bi/pan/omni/etc)

- Anything that claims monogomy OR polyamory are inherently abusive in dynamic

And there is many other radfem bulletpoints but I am working off the top of my head and after a long day here. So use this to stoke your intrigue and please learn more about how to love your queer community rather than resent or hate it. Learn what radical feminism is, and how to get it out of your life.

So much love for this guy. Also I find it so funny how the TERFs are like "we feel so much sympathy for this small narcissistic young woman :(" (actual words used) after they physically attacked a disabled trans man to get him to shut up as fast as possible. Really embodies what they mean when they insist they "care"

why do you call it ‘radical feminism’ when it’s bankrolled by evangelicals and fascists and also there’s hardly any skateboards in it

Are the evangelicals bankrolling a primarily manhating lesbian atheist movement in the room with us right now?

They’re in the room with you, actually

Women's Liberation Front (WoLF), the only radical feminist organization which is active in US policy debates, has repeatedly collaborated with some of the biggest socially conservative organizations on the American right, including: Focus on the Family, the Family Research Council, Heritage Foundation, the Independent Women's Forum, and the Alliance Defending Freedom. All of these organizations are anti-feminist and homophobic, and at least one of them has advocated for making homosexuality illegal

Heron Greenesmith has done literally years of research on this topic, and last year basically said "it's so proven that the evangelical Right is funding transphobes and TERFs that spending more time on it is literally just wasting money except to track what they're doing."

This thread covers one year of their work, but this is of particular interest:

Hands Across the Aisle is explicitly a joint venture of rad fems and conservatives to push a bio-existentialist, transphobic agenda.

transphobia is truly such a miserable mindset. to live in a world where no one is mutable and nothing can be abstract. no one can change or decide who they want to be or enjoy the wonders of modern medicine. everyone has to live and die by pointless kindergarten rules, but no one can reimagine themselves or create a different world. don’t you get tired of black and white and making up boxes and plugging your ears to the reality that nature is complicated and funny, and human hearts can feel infinitely?

holy shit ur so right

image ID: screenshot of tags from bisexualnonsense reading: the thing radfems and conservatives have in common is that gender is punishment. it's something to endure and live up to. an obligation. that's why they get so mad when people reclaim it for themselves and embrace it and play it with. you're not supposed to like it you're supposed to suffer about it END ID

There is literally no moral value to any gender. It is All Morally Neutral. It should go without saying but I think we've circled back societally to assigning value and personality based on gender

This is actually exactly what I was talking about.

Not only is "men are evil" transphobic and adds to stereotypes that get men of color harassed and killed, but best case scenario, it paints men as incapable of being good and therefore why should we try to be?

As soon as the anti-trans groups get you to agree to hate cis men, they will go in for trans men, gay men, men of color, followed by nonbinary people and trans women. And on and on. It's already happening.

You are not immune to propaganda.

— Roxy Hall, Ten Theses on the Gender Question

it's fascinating to see people running their mouth about radical feminism who have clearly never actually interacted with radfem theory.

so many times I've seen randoms online try to claim that terfs don't really hate cis men, they just hate trans women. like,, see? this terf worked with a cis man to pass legislature to take away trans rights. clearly they respect men to some extent.

no, absolutely not. just because they're willing to sell out in a second to stop trans rights, does not mean that they don't fundamentally distrust/dislike "males" and want female supremacy. they think every human assigned male is entirely different from them, biologically inferior because of a lack of access to reproduction, and predisposed to anger, violence, and incapable of emotional depth.

they Other men, or rather, who they consider men.

sure, TIRFs exist and claim to have the True, Modern Radical Feminism. they use gender essentialism instead, insisting that this predisposition to abuse is tied to manhood alone, and therefore trans women are safe and trans men are not. but this does not really protect trans women, as any tie to masculinity can revoke their womanhood, and any form of gender essentialism is bad for all trans people.

not to mention that they fundamentally misunderstand radical feminism; it really isn't supposed to work based off of traits like that. the entire ideology is based off of reproductive control, which is biological in nature. TIRFs are simply trying to make this flawed ideology work for trans people, rather than recognizing that any supremacist ideology is based in fascism. (and their entire concept of biology is wrong and colonialist but that's another topic entirely)

back to my point, radical feminism is all about the idea that gender exists solely to oppress females, and that this, the patriarchy, is essentially a conspiracy between all males to maintain access to reproduction.

this is an absurdly simplistic, reductive take that ignores most of human history and an ounce of intersectionality (and don't say I'm the one who stripped the intersectionality. radfems teach themselves that misogyny is worse than all forms of oppression and that male privilege almost always supersedes racism to such an extent that all males collude to maintain systemic sexism).

regardless, it's their primary tenant. and it's the reason trans people terrify them. we blur the lines between male and female. we represent the culmination of the erasure of the female sex.

sound anything like white supremacy to you?

..

tldr; terfs have zero respect or love for cis men, they simply sell out easily. radical feminism teaches that the patriarchy exists to give males reproductive access, and this supersedes all other oppression. they also believe all males are biologically predisposed to aggression and abuse. they hate trans women because they believe this applies to them too.

This is what I keep saying. Radical feminism is at its heart white supremacist. It imposes its own theory of biological essentialism as a universal, biological classifications rooted in idealized white womanhood, white fragility and toxic white femininity, and completely erases all the racist, ableist, classist etc. intersections of privilege. Its misandry is a grift for cis white women to rationalize themselves as the Most Oppressed while remaining classist, ableist, homophobic, transphobic and racist as shit.

Radical feminism wasn't originally transphobic, but was fundamentally built on the exclusion of all men, equating people with systems. It was developed purely among university educated cis white women for the purpose of reclaiming their reproductive and sexual rights. All other women were mere afterthoughts to this project or considered mere extensions of themselves. This recipe for toxicity is what has now been carried to its natural conclusion.

However, I believe that radfems obsession with trans women is an outgrowth of the fact that it depends on leveraging the same white female fragility that tradfems do, by calling for protection from "mutant and predatory underclasses". Among conservative white women, this used to be first and foremost black people, especially black women. White progressive politics can't make a bogeyman out of race and class, but by casting masculinity as the predator and bio essentialist white womanhood as the victim, everyone who falls outside of the latter necessarily becomes a threat, especially black women and brown women, who have historically been and still continue to be systemically stripped of their womanhood. It's not a coincidence that so many anti-trans laws penalize cis black women.

In my view, the project of radical feminism is to use bio essentialism to retain a female white supremacist power base by consistently casting themselves as both the most victimized and their saviours. It's why radical feminism is equally oppressive to disabled, working class, queer and BIPOC people as trans folk.