@thoughtfulchaos773 / thoughtfulchaos773.tumblr.com
It's a love story in under 2 minutes. Part One.
Proof: She was fucking beautiful you would have lost your mind, Sydney comes back, and Carmy is in a trance; Carmy wants to provide amusement and enjoyment for Sydney by giving her what he assumes she wants, making her happy. Who's Claire? Hi, I'm Claire/death stare. I'm sorry you're here. These words, you will be mine. I don't want you to think I was jealous or anything. I wouldn't want to do it without you. A stare that holds many words.
Fun fact that every episode in season 3 is someone saying the words "I love you" to someone.
3x01 Carmy to Richie. Natalie to carmy 3x02 Syd to Emmanuel- Richie recalling those words to carmy. 3x03 Jimmy to natalie. 3x04 Neil to Ted and Richie to Eva. 3x05 Sammy to Ted fak Neil. fak to sammy. 3x06 Tina to david. 3x07 Uncle Gary to the faks. Natalie to pete. 3x08 Donna (through the song baby I love you) over to Natalie. Natalie to pete.
In 3x09*what i like to call the sydcarmy episode*- the word love comes across 17 times. Such as the Words in strange currencies. Claire's love you flashback. Computer's advise Jimmy to tell carmy he loves him. Claire telling the faks this about 5 times when they visit in the hospital.
3x10- Luca to Adam and Adam to Luca. The claire memory where I love you is said 3 times.
Donna, noting that she loves someone and just doesn't know how to show it, so instead, it's through song? I'm not saying Carmy is like Donna, but I believe he learned his communication style from her—he loves but doesn’t know how to express it, especially regarding romantic love.
For Carmy, saying "I love you" he was often forced to say those words to end arguments during his childhood. However, when it comes to the voicemail, does he genuinely feel love for Claire? He tells Fak that he loves Claire but maybe in that moment, Carmy wasn’t being honest with himself or his feelings. We should remember that, for Carmy, saying "I love you" has often been a way to avoid deeper truths and that was taught.
As a SydCarmy shipper, I'm amused in how their relationship is highlighted in Season 2, primarily through song. Specifically, in the lyrics related to Syd and Carmy, the word "love" appears frequently. This theme of love also resurfaces in Season 3 with the song blowing Kisses, reminding us that despite their struggles, there is love between Sydney and Carmy as they navigate their issues.
I believe 'I love you' has both positive and negative effects for Carmy. On one hand, it can serve as a way to avoid difficult conversations. On the other hand, it reminds us that beneath all the dysfunction, love exists in this story. This love takes many forms: familial, platonic, and romantic.
Sydney was right. The adventure to get the star became The Carmy show.
But his face when she tells him off! There's just this tiny bit of hurt because in his mind, he's making it all about Syd? Its like a microexpression of shock on his face and he wanted to say more or just completely unravel at that expo station. But once sydney emphasizes, I think both of you -pulls Carmy back in as he remembers Richie is there.
Richie, laser focused on Carmy as Carmy is just seconds away from collapsing and screaming, I'm doing this all for you, Chef! Love me!
A few thoughts because putting this all together makes me think:
-Syd's not jealous at all; she just knows Carmy's actions say differently ever since they first met. Why would he be seeing this girl Claire and keep it from Sydney?
Carmy introduced Claire as a friend, but Sydney still refers to her as Carmy's girlfriend. Sydney doesn't like that Carmy only calls Claire a friend. Sydney may think that because Claire and Carmy spend a lot of time together. Because he's focusing on her it must be exclusive.
The 2x08 argument is hilarious, a business partner ignoring the rest of the argument and cutting to "she's not my girlfriend." Why is that your "mentee's" business?
Carmy is stringing Claire along through Sydney's eyes. This is one of the things he needs to decide and put a label on it for the sake of their relationship. Carmy tells Sydney personally that he doesn't want to be shitty- this is directed at Sydney and I think she's aware of it but she makes it simple. Just don't be shitty and if and when Carmy is shitty, she will hold him accountable. unlike people who tell Carmy never to apologize.
Translation of the table acene: Sydney, I understand now that I should be spending time with you and only you. I should make sure youre not alone and listen to all your fears and reassure you when you have doubts. Claire is great and all, but in the end I need you and you need me.
Now, watching the scene at the table, did Carmy and Sydney both know that he would have to end things with Claire now that he had told her she has his full focus?
If this is the case- Carmy caring about what others think (Richie), he failed the test of choosing Sydney above all else. Carmy wants to see Claire ethoughts. That night, meaning later on they can talk (where he can end it) and Sydney knows it isn't the right time to see Claire but he goes anyway and leaves Sydney alone. Breaking the promise and thus season 3 carmy comes out. All because he felt he failed Sydney.
Now watching season 3: Carmy wants to call Claire, But he avoids it only because Sydney never mentioned he should call Claire. Actually he was even going to argue with Sydney if she meant claire. He asked her do you even think she wants to talk me right now? Because he would have to talk the inevitable- that he does not love claire.
He also has to address that moment in that freezer was possibly about Sydney.
Sidebar about the break up with claire and carmy: Maybe that whole sentence about being a psycho and not providing joy and amusement had to do with not providing a relationship- joy- amusement for Sydney and that being a waste time because he left her alone. He failed her after all. The only way he can provide something close to joy for Sydney is to be like Chef david.
That's all I have for now, but this is a mess! If this made you think of something different, reblog or reply. I'd love to hear your thoughts.
Continuing on, Natalie must know Claire and Carmy are official now. In 2x05, Sydney had no problem telling Natalie that she needed Carmy. But now, this conversation about needing each other needs to be private since Carmy has made his relationship with Claire exclusive. Why does it need to be a secret that Sydney needs his focus?
Sometimes I wonder if they're aware of their feelings for each other. But this has me leaning towards they know there's a grey area, and they know that regular boundaries need to exist if this were a regular business "mentor/mentee" to the prying eyes.
In Carmy's mind (and this is learned behavior from his experiences with Mikey), in order for Syd to love and need him, he has believed he has to be the best. Trying to be "the best" is ruining his life and his relationships. Trying to "fix" his family and the restaurant is, too. I think he has realized this now.
I don't think Syd likes Carmy just because he's "the best" she likes his passion and creativity. You can tell she's really wowed by the drawings from the chaos menu and is even a bit floored in that moment, like, where did that come from?
I want so badly for Carmy to share that side of himself with her. I want so badly for Syd to open up and be vulnerable with him again, and for him to show up for her independent of it having to do with the restaurant. To also let her be the captain in full, since she obviously has the business experience and he doesn't.
These two are literally like a married couple whose whole lives are lived inside this restaurant but they're not experiencing physical and emotional intimacy with each other. People who have compared them to characters in Mad Men: Don and Peggy had lives and relationships outside of their workplace relationship. Carmy and Syd really don't.
I'm obsessed with Richie and Carmy. The core of The Bear's story is loneliness. It's just that sometimes the sleight of hand is used.
Although it can be considered a work drama, I still feel this shows a love story. Its core is the loneliness surrounding Carmy and Richie after Mikey's death.
They don't provide much information about Richie's love story—whether or not he wants to be with someone again. Instead, the focus is on Richie finding purpose after the divorce.
The last time his love story is mentioned is 1x06. This is the first insight we get into Richie's loneliness: Richie is trying to tell a story about a life he once lived with his best friend and is disconnected from the woman at the dinner table. He doesn't date again. But that night sets him off to really resist any change Carmy and Sydney implemented.
In the second season, the answer to Richie finding life after mourning Mikey and Tiffany is finding purpose in work.
Although Richie almost reached his end goal and found joy in work, as Jessie points out in 3x10, finding connections outside of work still matters.
But it's something Richie doesn't like to talk about. Like most of his fans hate talking about love in the show.
And yes this is totally about Richie and Carmy's love story (because Tiffany/Claire are connected just like Jessie and Syd)
All signs point to Richie finding love with Jessie. And sydcarmy people are told we're overthinking looks, but most clocked this the first time- and all hoped Jessie would come back in season 3, and she has- the bear has to be about Carmy and Richie's love story, right?
Loneliness wasn't just brought up with Richie- its also brought up with Carmy
1x02: We watch Carmy in his apartment, and it becomes clear that he's incredibly lonely. He also feels that to find joy and amusement, he must find it in the company of other people. Carmy knows more than Richie, and he wants connections.
Because he promises Sydney she's not alone, and that sets off a journey of leaving her alone- breaking his promises and being diligent on it never happening again- so much so he sacrifices his own joy.
It even starts the season with an apology for leaving his partner alone.
As Richie comes to terms with his loneliness, Carmy finds someone he doesn't want to be without and is still trying to figure out what it means and what he should do about it.
I think by the end of season 3, they have some idea on the key to life is connection. Carmy, from the words of chef Terry, will do what he wants, how he wants, with the people he wants to do it with. While Richie, with the words of Jessie, will find someone (jessie) to inspire him outside of work.
It's a love story, intertwining themes of friendship, loss, and new beginnings, bringing Richie and Carmy together (they'll be the newfound best friends) and discovering love amidst tragedy.
If nothing else. There's a wedding coming up. Richie sang his heart out to lyrics it's a love story
What else should I think?
you all remember when sydcarmy fans compared the speech under the table with a scene in a movie called : as good as it gets .
and today I want to talk about that movie because I find it interesting and after I watched it I became certain that there´s much awaits us in the upcoming season of the bear , so let´s get start and see the similiraties between the movie and the show , have fun :
Melvin Udall a writer who writes about love and romance but he doesn´t act in real life like his romantic books , like Carmen Berzatto who is a famous chef , who is an artist in his field who personality must be a calm and gentle one like chef terry but his work doesn´t fit his personality in real life , he is living in a mess like Melvin, the two of them have a complicated characters and they are trying not to be shitty with the women they like + they have problem with the word ´´love´´ it´s very difficult for them.
now I noticed that during the movie , most of the conversations between Melvin and Carol are in the table :
there´s much scene btw ,not only these two . it reminds me of how much scenes in the bear with carmy and syd talking and a table presents between them.
like you feel the table is an obstacle between the two because later in the movie the love confession happened with the absence of the table .
now this is some intersting scenes from the script of the movie :
Melvin: I have to see you
carol: because
melvin: it relaxes me ..................
carmen when he sees or remembers or hear syd , he becomes relaxed , just like melvin he is relaxing when he sees carol .
the panic scene guys !!!!!!!!
this is melvin final confession telling carol what he sees when he watches her working in the restaurent .
carmen stares will not be for a waste ............
he enjoys watching her emmmmmmmmmmmm:
it reminds of that scene in season one when carmen said to syd that his brother had passed away and he went to Al anon and syd became confused : like the scene is giving me the same vibes .
and now the famous quotes :
melvin said that and carmen said: you make me better at this .
so in the movie carol in that scene knows that there´s more than feelings here , she knows: it means love .
and under the table scene in the bear when syd repeated his words and that awkward stares and silence , I swear that syd felt something more than friends or partners or chefs , she felt in that moment a love invitation from carmen, that´s why the scene was ambigious for the most of audience.
the bear is a love story :
YES!!! Let me hug you!
This is clearly a love story!
Has anyone mentioned that this sequence is akin to the horror genre? At the beginning of the episode, 13 Ghosts by Nine Inch Nails is played. (The last time we heard NIN was the love scene with Claire and Carmy.) The Faks in the next scene talk about a haunting, and Carmy eerily stares at the plate and the Tuesday surprise before going in the walk-in to think about Claire, punishing himself for almost allowing Claire to haunt him instead of just ending it.
But with the transition and the camera angle, as we transition to Sydney, the music still plays, and because Carmy won't let things go to rest that doesn't serve him, Sydney is being haunted by the same people.
You know I’ve been rewatching one of my other favorite shows of all time, The Haunting of Hill House, and I actually DO see so many parallels between it & The Bear. And I mean that in the best, most flattering way. I’ve been thinking about making a meta about it honestly.
Hill House, the TV show and the book honestly, used horror to tell a love story. The analogies were about how a marriage can be like a haunted house. How grief can be like a ghost. And I see so many threads that are mirrored in The Bear, it’s always played with the idea that grief can haunt you, can destroy you even.
So it makes sense The Bear would also play with the idea that what seems to be Love on its face, is revealed to be horrifying, damaging, hurtful even. Harmful. Especially with the idea Claire, has shades of Donna in her characterization. What’s more horrifying than realizing your mommy issues led you to fuck a woman who reminds you of your mom?! 😬 Nightmare fuel my good man!
But Hill House also played with how trauma and grief can basically consume a whole family. Just like this haunt is consuming The Bear. Syd is suffering, so Carmy has to cut off the haunt so it can’t feed anymore!
Omg so I thought of Haunting of Hill House when I watched this!!! Because Claire reminded me of this image...
So that means we're onto something also how both shows tell about dysfunction and addiction. Need to rewatch that show. So good your opinion of this haunting.
Oo! Another scary mother! Literally! Claire so does remind of hauntLivia!
I started my Hill House rewatch a week back and the connections are so stark, I wondered if Storer might be a Shirley Jackson fan. Her novel is certainly a classic and turned what a love story is, on its head. Sort of what The Bear is doing now. And Flannigan is certainly a contemporary of Storer too. If the reveal finally is that its been a love story the whole time, I wouldn’t be able to deny the parallels I don’t think.
Yes @ambeauty said it too. The magic trick- sleight of hand is the bear has been a love story this whole time. A show that draws in the masculine flips it's head on the romance genre.
@currymanganese @turbulenthandholding @whenmemorydies @brokenwinebox @espumado in case anyone is interested.
Has anyone mentioned that this sequence is akin to the horror genre? At the beginning of the episode, 13 Ghosts by Nine Inch Nails is played. (The last time we heard NIN was the love scene with Claire and Carmy.) The Faks in the next scene talk about a haunting, and Carmy eerily stares at the plate and the Tuesday surprise before going in the walk-in to think about Claire, punishing himself for almost allowing Claire to haunt him instead of just ending it.
But with the transition and the camera angle, as we transition to Sydney, the music still plays, and because Carmy won't let things go to rest that doesn't serve him, Sydney is being haunted by the same people.
You know I’ve been rewatching one of my other favorite shows of all time, The Haunting of Hill House, and I actually DO see so many parallels between it & The Bear. And I mean that in the best, most flattering way. I’ve been thinking about making a meta about it honestly.
Hill House, the TV show and the book honestly, used horror to tell a love story. The analogies were about how a marriage can be like a haunted house. How grief can be like a ghost. And I see so many threads that are mirrored in The Bear, it’s always played with the idea that grief can haunt you, can destroy you even.
So it makes sense The Bear would also play with the idea that what seems to be Love on its face, is revealed to be horrifying, damaging, hurtful even. Harmful. Especially with the idea Claire, has shades of Donna in her characterization. What’s more horrifying than realizing your mommy issues led you to fuck a woman who reminds you of your mom?! 😬 Nightmare fuel my good man!
But Hill House also played with how trauma and grief can basically consume a whole family. Just like this haunt is consuming The Bear. Syd is suffering, so Carmy has to cut off the haunt so it can’t feed anymore!
Omg so I thought of Haunting of Hill House when I watched this!!! Because Claire reminded me of this image...
So that means we're onto something also how both shows tell about dysfunction and addiction. Need to rewatch that show. So good your opinion of this haunting.
I think Fak hammering on about being Carmy's best friend is the point of showing Carmy doesn't even have a friend.
Fak says he knows all of Carmy's nuances. While Richie says I know who you really are.
Carmy doesn't know himself, and Richie is going to be the best friend Carmy needs once Carmy reaches his full potential, and he's going to be the true wingman between Sydney and Carmy.
When Harry Met Sally, I love the subtle detail that Harry starts shaving consistently when his friend, Sally, comments that she likes him without the beard.
It's kind of like how Carmy is aiming to be the best chef because Sydney comments that he's the most excellent CDC in the entire United States of america. Or how Carmy gets the jacket because Sydney likes the jacket.
Just as @outmakingmoonshine observed, this isn't a "mushy gluey" love story. In all love stories, you have characters who are considered the helper and that's Richie and Fak all second season.
But the plot twist is that Fak is 'helping' one relationship while harming another - that's Sydney and Carmy.
The next plot twist is that Richie will be considered the helper when it comes to Syd and Carmy's partnership.
Richie will help the relationship because Richie was the one who got to meet Sydney's dad. He was the helper who made a good impression on Emmanuel.
While there was a 'close call" that episode 2x10 for the other helper/ (harmer) Fak did not have time talk to Emmanuel like Sydney requested, probably because stalling her dad would somehow give Fak enough time to further help Claire and Carmy. Since he would be in the dining room a bit longer, watching Carmy serve food. Where he would have time to introduce Carmy and Emmanuel and somehow out that Carmy is dating Claire.
We don't want Carmy and Emmanuel to meet under those circumstances.
It's why the helpers/harmers were busy looking in the mirror while Carmy had alone time to unite with his love Sydney under the table.
The more you see it, the more you can see the love story that's being written. Now I guess we're going to continue seeing Fak be harmful to Syd and Carmys' relationship, but in the end, they come together without the onlookers.
When I saw Carmy walking in the trailer, it reminded me of this scene with Richie in 1x06 post date.
This looks like a date gone wrong or a date that never happened for Carmy. Funny enough, the voiceover for this clip is Syd asking Why are you doing this and Carmy telling her they're going to get a star. (I also think this whole thing about the partnership agreement happens the first episode of the season.)
There are so many clips in that trailer that scream romantic comedy, even the sequence of the trailer.
Then after he says with claire it was a waste of time we go to this partnership agreement:
And a talk with Pete that either has to do with a living arrangement or a partnership with Carmy.
BTW- A "good thing" is always used in The Bear. Steven said it to Carmy when he freaked out about Richie andMikeyy trying to hook him up.
There's still time surrounding Claire while calm represents Sydney. Also, Claire is getting these weird close-up shots that I only see with his family.
Time again with claire- waste of time- going slow- go faster motherfucker etc.
Another hint at a Romantic comedy-
The romantic co-lead meets with a different partner while the romantic interest waits for her lead - they don't seem to be together...
Plot: The guy commits to work full time after breaking up with romantic interest. But by committing to work instead of finding misery he finds joy in everything, including his business partner.
The Bear
There are a few writers on this ship. This should interest you, it was released 2 weeks ago.
My biggest takeaway from this is learning how involved Joanna is in the writing. She was a big part of the development phase of the show from the very beginning. She also confirmed she runs the writers' room and storer focuses mostly on directing.
There's no mention of Syd and Carmy's relationship, but it has me questioning how involved Joanna is in the changes made to The Bear. I know she said in a magazine interview she asked Chris early on in the script if they hooked up, and although Chris said no, I still think it was considered. Keep in mind that this script is in early development and has room to change.
I also choose to believe this change because Sydney character is so different from the pilot script.
And just remember the "platonic and messy" tag we use here is because of Joanna.
How did I miss this?!? I follow the Austin Film Festival YouTube.
This is such a great interview about writing and how The Bear is structured as a show. And how it evolved into the show we have now. Interesting because it very much confirmed some theories I've had for a while about what changed in the first season with Sydney becoming a more important character and the Berzatto's as a family story being pared down and then moved to S2 in Fishes. V. interesting.
@kdbleu I just came here to see if you’d reblogged this, since I know you love Joanna Calo as much as I do…
This interview is incredible and @thoughtfulchaos773 , I agree, I think Sydcarmy is/was considered largely because of her input.
In this interview, she talks so much about each character’s story and the need for a slow build, and how change isn’t linear and clear and once-and done — I don’t know whether that speaks directly to Sydcarmy, probably not, but it DOES speak to why this show is so fucking great, and I’m convinced J. Calo is behind a lot of it.
Like, those little touches of Marcus banging down the tray of donuts, of the first time we see Donna’s face turn, all those moments she mentioned in this interview… so much of THAT is what I love about this show. Gah. Just so subtle and so real and so good.
I love that she mentions being a mom in so many of her interviews; I love the way she talks about her partnership with Storer — that it isn’t magical, their first meeting wasn’t anything particularly special. That it’s about craft and doing the work and fitting the puzzle together. It makes creativity seem like good, productive, positive work. So here for it.
Well said! It's about the work! There's been so many mentions of the work environment being so positive and this has to be reason. There doesn't seem to be ego involved.
It's the camera movements, the close shots, and composition that make it look like a love montage from a John Hughes movie, and the angles that are fitting for an 80s ballad in the background
Also, I love that the close ups don't start until Carmy lays eyes on Sydney.
Long noticeable pause.
"I don't know, you know, I think um...maybe if i can provide more- more -more, amusement or enjoyment for myself it would be easier to provide for others, you know?"
Long noticeable pause
"I don't need to provide amusement or enjoyment...I don't need to receive any amusement or enjoyment...I'm completely fine with that..."
Carmy takes noticeable pause in both monologues before he transitions to this subject of amusement and joy.
Maybe it's about Sydney. The monologue in 2x03 can't be about Claire, because he gave her a fake number, for all he knows, he would never see her again.
Before he pauses, in both monologues, he mentions himself, and why he could never be in a relationship, in 2x03, he explains he always waits for the other shoe to drop. In 2x10, before the pause, he tells himself and Tina he's a psycho.
The thing is, he knows how to provide and receive amusement and enjoyment. Carmy is actively trying to make Sydney happy. He wants to get the star, and he provides her the jacket. After all, he says, "I am trying" to Sydney in 2x08 as he shows the detailed drawings.
What's not being said is that Carmy longs for a relationship with Sydney. But he wants it to be a good, loving relationship.
Maybe one day he will admit what he's really after.
