17 Essays I will eventually write (or not) that will get me kicked out of Star Wars fandom
1-Antisemitism and the attitude towards the Jedi. Genocide is bad and while you’re at it stop with the “well if they changed the way their religion works they’d have been fine” and also for the love of EVERYTHING stop changing the meaning of Hebrew names for your conlang. Also, yelling that the Jedi “secretly control the republic” leans into a bunch of dogwhistles, please stop.
Some y’all need to touch some grass like Jesus Christ (all respects to my mans) y’all have y’all entire self worth wrapped up with the Jedi order to the point where you think mfs saying anything about them equates to serious shit.
You. Are. Not. In. The. Jedi. Order. This. Series. Is. Fake.
I could easily say that hating the sith means you’re an pro American imperialism because the sith are obviously ussr/communist coded. Y’all see how that dumb all this shit is? Hell, I could get away with it too because my whole family is from the Former USSR
This shit is fictional, stop watering down something as serious as antisemitism because your feelings are hurt that bitches ain’t riding the Jedi all day.
Y’all equating mfs having an issue with Jedi with mfs who hate Jewish people is something else.
The real truth is y’all are mad because people say “the Jedi are dusty and crusty and don’t help mfs” so now you feel the need to bring real world serious shit in so you can guilt trip bitches. Sad.
Worst part is, this ain’t even a real belief y’all have. This is y’all picking these super sensitive subject matters then throwing them in people face because you know the average person won’t speak against it. I dunno who the fuck normalized this mentality in y’all but it’s not normal.
Why can’t y’all give shit like antisemitism the respect it deserves instead of using it as a talking point on some unrelated, stupid shit?
Y’all need to get offline and realize you got some issues
Hi dude, I’m Jewish, so kindly stfu, thanks! And if you can’t see parallels with people who say things like “well maybe if the Jedi had just changed their religion they wouldn’t have deserved to be killed” and the accusations of Jedi kidnapping children from other cultures, and the fact that there is a serious portion of fandom who actively promotes the idea that the Jedi are “the secret power behind the republic who control the military and political might” with some antisemitic beliefs, then I don’t know what to tell you! I’m well aware the series is fictional - I am just very very tired of reading fic or meta and getting hit with a bunch of dog whistles.
I also feel like the second blogger completely missed the point. The point of saying “hey this rhetoric has harmful parallels” is not to say “if you hate X you’re a bad person.” Nobody benefits from that. It is “thinking this sort of way and bringing these kind of arguments is harmful, and how you treat fiction can condition how you treat reality.”
I think we can all agree that the star wars fandom is one of the most toxic places to be, so taking even ONE bit of it serious is a huge commitment and finding people who agree with you, within, is something that can be extremely stressful.
That said:
I think interpreting politics of Star Wars and paralleling them to real life events is nothing bad. Not even if you find parallels to something morally wrong. In my opinion, fiction has to be problematic in some way, otherwise it’s a boring glorification of self inserts.
While I see the main problem, this post is concentrating on, are fans who claim certain things, I also feel like that not everything is as simple as that?!
It literally depends on what media you consume (old Republic, high Republic,.. legends/canon) and how you see the politics in this franchise - it all happens from a literal certain point of view.
Concerning the Jedi Order: yes, I also do think that the Jedi are heavily included in the Republic and wasn’t it for them, it would’ve fallen a long time ago (pun not intended) so saying that they have a major role and practically influence - if not lead - the Republic and its people, is just all pretend. I mean, the jedi inspire hope - which is a positiv and motivating feeling but if you can inspire people and they look up to you, it’s a way of building their morals, their way of life. - Which indicates that the Jedi are more than just their Order.
So saying that they “secretly influence and lead the Republic” might be a little exaggerated, but certainly isn’t out of spite/ a form of antisemitism (that said, it all depends on the person involved in discussions like that, but like I said this fandom is an overall toxic one) and if someone makes actual points and argues with in-universe examples, I don’t see an issue.
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Just generally speaking: “arguments” like “this is a form of antisemitism” or even implications of such allegations are the things that are hurtful.
I feel like a lot of people, who conveniently prefer the morally right side of fiction bash on fans of the morally wrong side of it, with allegations that those fans automatically live with the same morals as their favourite characters. Which is just?!?!@?
(You will rarely find people who actually defend mass murderers and torture in real life. Like.. we know the empire and the Sith are bad and if someone doesn’t- I’m concerned)
You can’t even argue with those people, because once someone throws the racist/antisemitism/homophobic/transphobic card, people will flock towards those “discussions” and will bully you regardless of if they’re in the fandom and know what they’re talking about, or not.
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This whole discussion seems so useless and harmful for all people involved. Like.. its just fiction. I could Interpret the whole franchise with a lot of different political views and might even argue that a lot of Leitmotive are actually propaganda.
And it’s okay if you do, just… don’t take it to extremes/ out on other people.
I genuinely don’t know how to say this, but with all due respect, I think you’re letting your personal feelings cloud your judgement here.
Discussions about bigotry are never comfortable. Discussions where you feel you are being told you hold bigoted views are never comfortable. That does not mean those conversations don’t need to happen. Similarly, the fact that some people will throw around terms like antisemitism as virtue signaling does not change that conversations about antisemitism (or any other form of bigotry) need to happen. Having those conversations is not extreme, nor lashing out at anyone. They are most certainly not useless either. And quite frankly, NOT having those conversations is far more hurtful than having them will ever be; that’s how bigotry festers. It never goes away if you never address it.
For all that it might seem like a positive space if people never get upset, all that’s happening is maintaining the status quo. The people affected by systemic oppression continue to suffer - and trust me, while it isnt fun to be called a racist, it is far worse to be on the receiving end of racism. Ultimately, you can decide someone who has called you a racist is wrong and ignore them. You cannot escape living in a racist society. And in that vein, I cannot force you to listen to what I am saying. I do, however, hope you will listen.
(Furthermore, there is deeper conversation about something called tone policing to be had here, but that’ll have to be for another time)
Which brings me to my next point: every single one of us has internalized bigotry in some way or another. It’s a result of growing up in bigoted societies. Fortunately for us, to fight bigotry does not require us to have only had perfect thoughts for our entire lives - only to acknowledge the ways our thinking has been wrong, and seek to do better. Over and over again. It’s lifelong work, and it’s hard work, but it’s worthwhile.
With that out of the way, lets get started on fandom. I’m not here to say people can’t like fucked up things in fiction - but there comes a problem when people cannot acknowledge to themselves that those things are fucked up. Fiction may not be reality, but it doesn’t exist in isolation of it either. It’s made and interacted with by real people, and therefore it can, in fact, be reflective of people’s real world personal biases. (Also, as an aside? There unfortunately are people who will defend real-life mass murderers. It’s remarkably common, actually.)
Fiction, as you mentioned, is often used allegorically to real life issues and events. In drawing those comparisons, we bridge the gap of fiction and reality (drawing elements of the real into the unreal). Because those elements of the real are based off of the struggles of and therefore affect real life people, we have a responsibility to treat those subjects with respect. Once again, I'm not saying people shouldn't explore complex thought in fiction - in fact, I think people should do exactly that - but rather that doing so requires us to move delicately.
It is for exactly that reason that the common fandom trend of claiming the Jedi secretly control the republic is so concerning. That alone falls into mimicking a longstanding pattern of antisemitic rhetoric beat for beat. The fact that this rhetoric is being used in conjunction with a number of other antisemitic talking points (such as, to use one of OP’s examples, the theft of children) things really only get worse. It adds up to a pattern of antisemitic behavior in a wider trend. Furthermore, people are not using this rhetoric to be metaphorical about how the Jedi can inspire people - they are using this to claim that it was, in fact, moral within the narrative for the Jedi to be victims of genocide. I think it's pretty clear why this might make a Jewish fan nervous; especially given that these are views of real life fans, and not just fictional characters intentionally written as evil.
(As another aside, I think it is important to remember that there are plenty of groups of people who are inspiring and are important members of the community (from doctors to teachers to janitors) who aren't regularly described as "secretly controlling society." The fact that this is the rhetoric used here is very specifically an antisemitic red flag. As I said before, these things are very much about patterns of behavior and how they fit into larger trends. Furthermore, people can unknowingly or unthinkingly play into these trends, and while there may be no malicious intent behind that lack of awareness the hurt that it causes exists regardless.)
Ultimately, this renders trying to claim that "saying that [the Jedi] 'secretly influence and lead the Republic”' might be a little exaggerated, but certainly isn’t out of spite/ a form of antisemitism" unacceptably disrespectful. OP is Jewish, and it is never appropriate to try to tell a Jewish person what is or isn't antisemitic. Doing that in itself is an antisemitic act. I don't bring this up as an attack on your person - merely to highlight the reality and the gravity of the situation, so that in the future we can all do better and correct our behavior (see above re: internalized bigotry). If no one will ever teach us when a change of behavior or an apology is necessary, none of us will ever learn.
Again, I can't force you to listen to me. I certainly can't force you to read all of this either - though if you've made it here to the end I thank you for your time, and ask only that you give what I've said some thought.