Need a Penelope and Menelaus friendship agenda
Priam’s little “I don’t blame you, I blame fate and the gods. Sit with me. Sit with me and see your old husband and your people” to Helen will never not get me
hermesmoly reblogged
heyo! hope you’re having a good day :>
I’m curious, what is your take on Cassandra and Oenone? They are two women in the Epic Cycle with very tragic endings, but both are still very cool in their own right!
Hiya! Thank you for the ask!!
I haven’t had time to read any original Greek Myth classics works other than the Iliad, so my knowledge is a bit limited on this matter. However I have somewhat a general knowledge of their tales and I will give my opinions based on that.
The women of Greek Myth are very interesting to me, as they are complex people and I love the way they embrace their femininity, both in good and bad ways.
Cassandra is just a tragic woman, I think it’s quite brave and understandable for her to deny Apollo. After that even when no one believed her, she still voiced out her prophecies. Her ending was just tragic, being passed from one man to another, being defiled and then being killed as a minor collateral damage. Idk if it’s better that a woman killed her and not a man.
I think she’s important to the overall story as an helpless observer, but unlike other women who know almost nothing, her tragedy is that she knows something, probably too much. This is also why I added her in that fanfic of Helen, hehe. She acted quite bitter and insane there but it’s under the eyes of Helen, another observer who will not be able to understand throughout.
She’s like those women who are very smart and knowledgeable, unfortunately too smart for her own good. No one could keep up with her intellect, and as a result, is seen as a mad woman.
Oenone is even more tragic, as she has basically nothing to do with the Trojan War or even the Priam family. She has no part in the fight. She simply and unfortunately married to Paris. And for her, there was no Paris the prince, covering in shining stuffs and nice things for, but a shepherd, a nobody. She knew him as he was (or did she?)
Her life with Paris was before he knew he was a prince, it’s a simple and honest life (Alexa plays Married life from Up), until bro realized he was a prince and picking another married woman is better (bro your wife’s right there)😭😭😭. She died still loving Paris and out of guilt and grief.
Thank you for answering!!
Cassandra’s case is so tragic, and I can’t help but think of how women often get violent against women because of circumstances (like Cassandra pulling Helen’s hair in a fit of rage when she arrived at Troy, to Cassandra being killed by Clytemnestra because she was a liability/Agamemnon’s forced concubine. It’s always those sisters 😭). You are right, to Helen Cassandra is Bitter and insane as a Mad Woman, and I like how Helen and Cassandra can never be truly close because of that.
AND YES Oenone was just an outsider!! She didn’t deserve any of that heartache!!
Reading Ajax by Sophocles for the first time: Part 1
some notes and comments! (I am reading the version translated by Ian Johnston) and tagging @katerinaaqu because I REALLY want to hear their thoughts as well as @venomspecs for being the catalyst for me to read this! :>
- Odysseus calling Athena "the god I cherish the most" is so sweet they really are mentor and mentee
- "We don’t know anything for certain." Man what a powerful line, It can be used for so many contexts within the Epic Cycle
- I love how Odysseus' first reaction is "How could he have done something so reckless?" just. ugh speaks to him as a character and as a comrade
- "and kept on chopping down and slaughtering, the ones with horns by slicing through their spines, until they made a circle all around him." CHILLS. DOWN MY SPINE.
- "I kept encouraging him" ATHENA NO???
- " But the sweetest laughter comes from mocking enemies. Is that not true?" I love this specific unhinged Athena so much
- I like that Ajax speaks in the Third Person. I can very much see him doing that
- Ajax really thought Athena would choose him over Odysseus XD
- "I see that in our lives we are no more than phantoms, insubstantial shadows."
- Athena of course uses this Ajax scenario to scold Odysseus over "never ever speaking against gods or be egotistical" I cantttt
- "Envy creeps up against the man of wealth and power. And yet, without the great, we lesser men are fragile ramparts in our own defence."
- I feel so bad for Tecmessa ;; she and her son deserve a lot more
- "Come, help me kill myself" I mean, what do you SAY to that,,
- "these awesome hands, against tame animal" Oh Ajax.
- "If with my distorted mind and eyes," so Athena permanently blinds Ajax? Eye fatigue? Or is it more metaphorical...
- Ajax's last conversation with his son is quite interesting. He loves his kid enough that he agrees with Tecmessa about her decision to keep him away from Ajax's madness. Trusts Teucer to take care of him. Gives him his own shield. "My other weapons you will bury with me." Does the kid even fully grasp that his dad is going to kill himself?
- "Father, with god’s help even a worthless man can be victorious. But I believe I’ll win glory on my own without them." DAMN he said that to his father with his whole chest!
- Telling Athena, the Athena, to go "stand there with the other Argives" IS SO??? Ajax you are impressively sacrilegious
Stopping around line 930 since this play seems to be 1700+ lines long ^^ Will continue tomorrow since it is late night here.
That scene with Doof still seeing 16 year old Vanessa as a little girl but make it Agamemnon and 30+ year old Menelaus
Oenone deserved her happy ending, God I hate that she committed suicide for Paris and they blame her for abandoning him when he abandoned her
You get it! T-T
Oenone should've been kissing girls like Medea and lived the rest of her days in peace, like why commit to her being the "bitter first wife" who refused the man who abandoned her (AND THEIR KID BTW) medical care then retract it and say she regrets it? And lose her life for it? Like no! Let her be mean! Anyone who blames her gets my fists!
(Alternatively, I do view Oenone refusing to treat Paris as a sort of karma for killing Corythus, their forgotten son. Either way her dying is so stupid and I wish authors back then knew what to do with her character.)
Anonymous asked:
One thing I hate about some poly-shipping in GrecoMyths is people erasing the role of a parent in a canon couple's relationship (for example, Paris replacing Menelaus as Hermione's father, Patrochilles shippers ignoring Deidamia, or replacing Penelope with Diomedes as Telemachus' parent).
I guess that doesn't count as poly shipping then? That's more like rewriting canon lol
Menelaus deserves a little murder. As a treat
#mainly about deiphobus since he never was granted the chance to kill paris 😩#but yeah. he’s no warmonger but also not one to shy away from killing#his (euripides version) little talk about murdering odysseus and calchas is so funny i need that energy but with someone else#menelaus#epic cycle#the iliad
This just in: Most Desired Woman in the World chose a Cursed Second Son Ginger as Her Husband
Let’s settle this Helen/Menelaus ship name debacle
We all talk about Odysseus initially not wanting to join the Trojan War because of his wife and baby and you think years during the war he’d look at Menelaus and think “Oh. What if it was Penelope who was kidnapped?” And he’d be so sure Menelaus would still be beside him if that was the case.
Stop don’t think about Menelaus and Patroclus’ friendship and how Menelaus still probably blames himself for his friend’s death
#bro sees a statue of mene protecting patroclus’ body and fell down on their knees#and how that was mene’s finest hour.#his aristeia. defending his friend#on the floor#menelaus#patroclus#the iliad#the iliad book 17#greek mythology#epic cycle#imagine them with the ‘whats the softest way to say you took away my friend my buddy’
Thinking about this scene in Haunting of Hill House where the husband exchanges these words with his ghost wife and I can’t help but picture Agamemnon and Clytemnestra talking in the afterlife
#yes i admit! i am very delulu when it comes to agacly#but ‘we were solid babe’ was definitely them before iphigenia’s death#aga’s crime is obvious but#clytemnestra being super aware of what she did to her remaining kids and it pains the both of them so much#they became people they did not want to be!’#they killed their children literally and metaphorically#that really wasnt them!!#clytemnestra#agamemnon#the oresteia#Clytemnestra x agamemnon#epic cycle
my friend @foxbaes drew some Menelen for my birthday :D
hermesmoly reblogged
Homer: Are you aware that many Iliad characters are first time fathers? That all of them in one way or another misses a big chunk of their children’s life or never gets to see it at all?
Also Homer: leaves and never elaborates
A doodle for random parenting shiz basically. Order from left to right, top to bottom:
-Menelaus carrying a sleepy Hermione. @hermesmoly I was drawing this when the request came lolol
-Achilles and baby Neo. I don’t know if it’s a thing in other places but hanging on father’s leg and then let him moves it back and forth like an impromptu swing is quite a favorite pastime activity here.
-Odysseus and baby Telemachus who was trying to be a helicopter
-Hector and baby Astyanax when he was born.
-Probably Agamemnon and his three daughters, but I have no official designs. He tried to scold them and was failing. Tbh I feel like Agamemnon would be the type to cosplay buff Bubble from Powerpuff girls along with his daughters. I know he’s not that great but me delulu.
-Patroclus and Neoptolemus. Yes Patroclus contributed in raising him as well, the kid had 2 dads. Fight me.
The kids!!!
Give the people what they want and yearn for (A good depiction of Helen of Sparta and Menelaus)