I'm not gonna hop on aroallo posts and make it all about being ace cus that's called respecting basic boundaries but in return it would be nice if people understood that alloaces being allo doesn't guarantee full acceptance into romantic society the same way being allosexual doesn't automatically mean sexual acceptance. Like if society equates romance and sex as being the same then why assume aroallos wouldn't have any issues navigating sex? Why assume alloaces wouldn't struggle navigating romance then? Idk how on earth there's supposed be solidarity in the community if people don't wanna try to understand the rest of spectrum that's different to theirs...

I understand the impulse behind that post about legalizing polyamorous marriage everywhere but the fact that marriage is so economically important and the fact that it determines which forms of long-term relationships are considered acceptable within society should make you question the institution of marriage and understand it as a tool of class society. We don't need to expand the institution of marriage so it includes gay people, polyamorous people, etc, we need to abolish marriage entirely and make it so that people don't need to be married to be economically or personally secure

In discussions like this there are always some people who say that marriage should just be for fun or if you want to do it, but you don't even need to wait for marriage to be abolished if you just want a "for fun" marriage. I personally call someone my wife despite the fact that we're both legally not married to anyone. The entire point of marriage is to serve as a legally binding contract wherein the state provides the married couple with certain economic and social privileges, but also implicitly or explicitly mandates they must stay together. It was designed to place women under the direct ownership of men, to keep women in the home where they are easily exploited and abused where nobody else can see it happen. It also has the purpose of separating groups of workers into easily moved small units overall lacking in external support which are dependent on the needs of Capital. It also has the purpose of transferring responsibility of the disabled from the state and society as a whole to an individual who is expected to care for their disabled partner, or abuse them as they please. If you want to have a "for fun" marriage you can just start calling people your husbands or wives, we don't need to keep marriage around for that.

My main gripe with the posts that are like "love is love includes platonic/familial/queerplatonic/etc. love" is ofc that they still fully ignore and exclude loveless people.

But what is also quite noticeable is that they also never mention sexual love. Because, it seems, in one stance about love (beside the "everybody loves"), a lot of aspecs still agree with society: that sexual love either just straight-up doesn’t exist, or that it’s inherently bad and abusive (that loving someone sexually without romance is abuse, "only using them for sex" etc.)

And on the other hand you also have aspecs acting like, on a societal level, sexual love is seen as equal to romantic love (with phrasing such as "love that isn’t romantic or sexual is devalued by society"), as if romanceless sexual love isn’t seen as basically the worst thing ever.

While I don’t experience love per se, the only type of love I can relate to even remotely is specifically sexual love. I care a lot for people I’m sexually attracted to, and sex is very important to me overall. And let me tell you, me expressing interest in a purely sexual relationship, no matter if I’d label my feelings as love or anything similar, are not ever treated any better than friendships or platonic relationships are.

I’m demonised to hell and back from queer people and non-queer allies and queerphobes all the same for my feelings and opinions on sex. Sex is seen as something that should only happen in very specific situations, and only then is it "good"; any other type of sex is "bad"; it’s just the definition that varies slightly between those groups—and I fit none of their definitions for "good" sex. No one sees sexual love without romance as a positive thing, least of all something equal to romance. (And especially not sexual intimacy and closeness without love and romance (or friendship, in slightly more progressive views, but that’s rare tbh))

Its just very noticeable that the majority of queer people, and between those especially aspecs because they do talk about non-romantic love the most, still don’t see sexual love as something that could just exist. It’s very noticeable when there’s hundreds of posts broadening the definition of love to include literally everything but specifically sexual love. Endless lists about what love is in non-romantic ways, and it’s glaringly obvious that people just do not believe anyone could care for someone they "just" want to fuck, "just" have a sexual relationship with, without wanting to be labelled as friends or anything similar even when they do things other see as friendship because they cannot grasp that people can care for their sexual partners even without having feelings for them that aren’t sexual.

Just still seems very sex-negative to limit sex to be something that either happens between people in a different kind of relationship (usually romantic, but again, some do agree you can have sex with friends, too), or something emotionless between strangers who then never interact with each other again (which is also most of the time treated as a bad thing which should stop).

Point is: Maybe question why you exclude sexual love specifically from your post about non-romantic love. (And at the same time, also stop acting like every person must experience some type of love)

Btw if you see QPRs as superior to or 'more than' non-partnering friendships you are giving in to the relationship hierarchy and only repeating what QPRs have had to deal with in regard to being compared to romantic relationships

Aplatonic Masterpost

(I use italics in this post for stuff that is more my commentary/analysis/etc, as opposed to more “factual” summary)

Aplatonic Definitions & Overview:

“Aplatonic” was coined on AVEN in 2012 in a thread here by a homoromantic Ace who expressed being unable to apply the word “love” to their friendships.

The original coining doesn’t come with a particularly precise definition, and there’s been many discussions regarding differing definitions for it.  The following are two definitions which are often considered accurate for the term:

Another definition which has been attributed with aplatonic, but also disputed as a definition, is this:

This third definition would be more accurate for the term “aqueerplatonic”, but was misattributed to the term aplatonic in the past.  However, while this is not an accurate definition for aplatonic, the lines between platonic and queerplatonic attraction can be extremely blurry such that this may be relevant to some aplatonic experiences.

Other notes on Aplatonicism:

(More information and links regarding definitions of aplatonic are below under “Aplatonic Discussions”)

Aplatonic Pride Flags:

[Image Description: aplatonic flag with 4 horizontal stripes which are purple, blue, green, and light yellow/cream from top to bottom]

This was the original aplatonic flag, the oldest surviving link of it is found here, from 2015.

[Image Description: aplatonic flag with 4 horizontal stripes which are black, grey, white, and yellow from top to bottom]

This was an alternate aplatonic flag proposed in 2016 (link here).

(More information on these flags can be found at this link from lgbtq wiki)

Aplatonic Spectrum & Demiplatonic:

Aplatonic Spectrum, or apl-spec, is an umbrella term for people who experience little to no platonic attraction. (AUREA’s definition here)

Aplatonic Spectrum Flags: a masterpost with many aplatonic spectrum identities, their definitions, and their flags.

Demiplatonic Overview: a post I made about my involvement with the term demiplatonic and demiplatonic flags

Experiences Feeling Demiplatonic: a post I did for carnival of aros about why I feel demiplatonic

Aplatonic Discussions:

Over the years, there’s been a lot of misinformation and general lack of clear accurate information regarding this term, such that there’s been many discussions regarding the definition.  As someone who is somewhat younger to the community I probably also contributed to misinformation at times due to the sources I was looking at being themselves inaccurate.  

The above definitions are what I can best summarize from the posts I have seen discussing it but might be influenced by my own experiences and I don’t want to claim expertise and argue those as objective fact, considering how much differing discussion there has been.So, here’s links to various discussions regarding the definitions & misinformation around this term, such that you can assess other sources for yourself.

Links regarding aplatonic definitions & History:

Link 1: “Definitions of Aplatonic” thread on Arocalypse Forums 

Link 2: Tumblr thread refuting “not wanting qpr” definition, with many people adding to discussion.

Link 3: Tumblr thread refuting the “not wanting/having friends” definition that originated by exclusionists, and other misinformation on the term.

Link 4: an older Tumblr post with an infographic of aplatonic, with more recent comments by the OP about inaccuracies.

Link 5: another tumblr thread about the definition of aplatonic and ways people originally used it, and touches on why some people are uncomfortable with non a-spec people using it due to misuse by exclusionists.

Link 6: tumblr thread about aplatonic definitions and it’s usage relating to the a-spec community along with neurodivergency and traumatic experiences.

Link 7: tumblr post discussing who can “use” the term aplatonic and discusses history of how meaning has warped over time.

Link 8: Tumblr short masterpost regarding aplatonic as a descriptor term used by aro community.

Related Terminology:

There are various terms that have similar but different meanings to aplatonic (which also come up in the linked discussion posts.  The word being defined has hyperlink to a source.)

Nonamorous:  a lifestyle choice or relationship style that does not include intimate, long-term partnerships, whether romantic or platonic.

Nonpartnering: not wanting partnered relationships; this is similar to nonamorous but coined in response to some people being uncomfortable with the implied opposite of nonamorous because of romance repulsion.

Aqueerplatonic: not experiencing queerplatonic attraction.

Loveless (aro): a recent term for aros who do not use “love” to describe their experiences, often due to it’s associations with romance and enforcement of amatonormativity. (Sources don’t show a particularly precise definition for this one)

(Additional reading regarding these terms:

-This is one of posts linked before, but I had added onto it with distinctions I perceive between these words and aplatonic

-This is another post discussing nonamory and queerplatonic, and pressures within the community to feel certain ways)

Aplatonic Tags:

(the links are from searching tag & filtering for most recent)

#Aplatonic (general aplatonic tag)

#Actually Aplatonic (aplatonic tag that’s more specific to prevent random & troll posts, so is more of the good quality posts)

#aplatonic spectrum (more specific to aplatonic spectrum stuff)

#apl spec (alternate tag with more specific to aplatonic spectrum stuff though doesn’t have many posts)

#apl positivity (tag for aplatonic positivity stuff or other positivity that is relevant for aplatonic people, I encourage people to use this more)

#demiplatonic (tag for more specifically demiplatonic stuff…. I use this a lot on my blog.  Tag does have some more troll/mocking posts unfortunately though, so bewarned)

#nonamorous (not aplatonic specific but generally tends to have more positivity and other discussions of adjacent topics regarding not having platonic partnerships and stuff)

#loveless aro (another aplatonic-adjacent topic regarding kind of opting out of the concept of love as an obligation/universal human concept)

Aplatonic Blog recs:

These are a mix of blogs I see actively involved in discussions on aplatonic and who I’ve taken notice of from following the aplatonic tag.

@aplatonicsafespace​​ (aplatonic specific blog which answered asks a lot but seems currently inactive)

@aroarolibrary​ (Is a general aro blog which has talked about aplatonic for a long time and has more historical information on the term. I went through eir aplatonic tag and found many of the posts I linked under aplatonic discussions)

@apl-h​​ (aplatonic focused blog)

@aromagni​ (my aro blog, I am demiplatonic so I talk more about apl-spec stuff and have organized tags for things you can search)

@askanaroace​​ (an aroace ask blog ran by an aplatonic person who’s answered asks about aplatonic stuff before)

@kyanitedragon​ (is a general blog that has posted apl headcanons & aesthetics/pride stuff fairly often)

[Feel free to add on to this post with more aplatonic blog recs or other resources!]

I never thought I'd have to say this but alloaro doesn't mean you have a high libido and says nothing about your sexual attraction.

"Alloaros have high libido and wanna fuck" is an alloarophobic stereotype and contributes to our ostracization and abuse. Some alloaros do in fact have high libido but claiming this is a standard or, in fact, a main experience of what it's like to be alloaro is alloarophobia. Some alloaros are sex repulsed or have a low libido and they're just as much alloaro as the rest of us.

I didn't think I'd see people saying "Asexual means you think sex is gross and you never wanna have sex and being alloaro means you just wanna use people as sex objects and are horny 24/7" in the year 2024 but here we are I guess.

i want to introduce you all to a project that is very close to my heart... or lack of one. anyway. for anyone who has ever wanted to play a poem. i'd like you to meet aromanticism

(link opens itch.io - she'll run on html in your browser! please be nice to her!)

here's a thing i haven't seen people talk about for whatever reason. romance can be a form of abuse. romance can be traumatizing. romance can be upsetting to experience. having romance forced upon you is a form of harassment. having someone repeatedly express romantic interest in you despite you rejecting them is awful and uncomfortable and violating.

something doesn't have to be sexual in nature or intent in order to be a form of harassment. romantic harassment is a real thing. the only reason nobody talks about that is because everyone is just too attached to the idea of romance as an inherent positive to realize that it can and has been used to hurt people.

"B-b-but what if ur not actually aro!! What if u just haven't met the right person yet?? Ur still young 🥺"

Than I'll stop using the aro label. I'll realize that I was incorrect and go on with my life. No one's changed my mind yet though. I haven't met that "special someone 🥺🥺🥺🥺" "yet" so I don't care about this entirely hypothetical person.

Aphobes are stupid ngl. Realizing that this label doesn't fit me (which it will almost definitely still fit me as I get older) isn't going to be some world shattering event. I'll move on, I'll accept my mistake. Lol

I'm not ace, but this post wasn't about being aroallo so go wild, I se you aroaces and aces, y'all r cool so you can tag it as ace and aroace

My main gripe with the posts that are like "love is love includes platonic/familial/queerplatonic/etc. love" is ofc that they still fully ignore and exclude loveless people.

But what is also quite noticeable is that they also never mention sexual love. Because, it seems, in one stance about love (beside the "everybody loves"), a lot of aspecs still agree with society: that sexual love either just straight-up doesn’t exist, or that it’s inherently bad and abusive (that loving someone sexually without romance is abuse, "only using them for sex" etc.)

And on the other hand you also have aspecs acting like, on a societal level, sexual love is seen as equal to romantic love (with phrasing such as "love that isn’t romantic or sexual is devalued by society"), as if romanceless sexual love isn’t seen as basically the worst thing ever.

While I don’t experience love per se, the only type of love I can relate to even remotely is specifically sexual love. I care a lot for people I’m sexually attracted to, and sex is very important to me overall. And let me tell you, me expressing interest in a purely sexual relationship, no matter if I’d label my feelings as love or anything similar, are not ever treated any better than friendships or platonic relationships are.

I’m demonised to hell and back from queer people and non-queer allies and queerphobes all the same for my feelings and opinions on sex. Sex is seen as something that should only happen in very specific situations, and only then is it "good"; any other type of sex is "bad"; it’s just the definition that varies slightly between those groups—and I fit none of their definitions for "good" sex. No one sees sexual love without romance as a positive thing, least of all something equal to romance. (And especially not sexual intimacy and closeness without love and romance (or friendship, in slightly more progressive views, but that’s rare tbh))

Its just very noticeable that the majority of queer people, and between those especially aspecs because they do talk about non-romantic love the most, still don’t see sexual love as something that could just exist. It’s very noticeable when there’s hundreds of posts broadening the definition of love to include literally everything but specifically sexual love. Endless lists about what love is in non-romantic ways, and it’s glaringly obvious that people just do not believe anyone could care for someone they "just" want to fuck, "just" have a sexual relationship with, without wanting to be labelled as friends or anything similar even when they do things other see as friendship because they cannot grasp that people can care for their sexual partners even without having feelings for them that aren’t sexual.

Just still seems very sex-negative to limit sex to be something that either happens between people in a different kind of relationship (usually romantic, but again, some do agree you can have sex with friends, too), or something emotionless between strangers who then never interact with each other again (which is also most of the time treated as a bad thing which should stop).

Point is: Maybe question why you exclude sexual love specifically from your post about non-romantic love. (And at the same time, also stop acting like every person must experience some type of love)

question:

anyone have any ideas for aro food symbols? someone wants to make foods for an a-spec affinity group i attended and all i can think of is kiwi lol

Macaroni? Ice cream?

I'll second macaroni; I used to see mac-aro-ni puns here and there back when I was more active in aro spaces

Poll

(because of something my sister told me and I’m confused so)

*but it’s fine as a word/thing for others to call themselves

Oh yeah and pls reblog for sample size!

I find it interesting that when alloaros try and say we're separate from aces and asexuality and that we don't want to be a part of the ace community, everybody riots. We're labeled as separatists and assholes and we're "trying to tear apart the community" or "kicking aroaces out of aro spaces" or whatever. (We're not, btw)

But when we enter aspec spaces as ourselves. When we join aspec discords, or real life support groups, or even just tag in the aspec tags. We are told, either explicitly or subtly, that we are not welcome. I have been told to my face that aspec groups "aren't for me" because I'm not ace. I've been told that I'm not allowed to talk about my sexuality literally at all because it makes people uncomfortable. I've been told to censor myself, cut pieces of my identity off, and make space for other people who refuse to make space for me.

Tell me why you people so desperately want to label us as ace, label us as a part of the ace community, while simultaneously never actually accepting us as one of you?

throwback to when i joined a discord server for aspecs, and everything there was centered around aces. colour themes were based off the ace and sunset aroace flag. the rules also centered around aces - i remember "mentions of sexual talk in #nsfw-sex channel only!" but romance could be discussed anywhere except "#aro-safe-space" and it really ticked me off. there were roles for aromantic, asexual, aroace and alloace, but not alloaro. not a single active person in that server was alloaro. most were alloace, and the ace focus even with the aroaces was HEAVY. it was honestly insufferable. when i asked why it was so heavily skewed to avoiding sex but allowing romance they said it was because "this is an aspec server we dont want to make the aces uncomfortable" and then proceeded to warn me for being aphobic when i argued that made zero sense. people were openly hostile to the idea of accommodating alloaros because "romance repulsion is kinda gross i mean...isnt that just homophobia/misogyny". i left after a few days. i have not tried an aspec space since.

they want us erased. its that simple. they dont want us to seperate because then they cant hide us in the aspec label. but they dont include us in aspec spaces because they dont want us to be visible. they want us to be wrong about being aro - either we're just insecure and someone will show us we're more than a sex object - or they want us to be aroace but just in denial, or they want us to be abusers that they can villify. they want us to not exist.

i know i'm probably guilty of this i'm just musing but does anyone else find it a little. strange. when people make posts telling alloromantics how to be better allies and all of the content is centered around online things like pride posts and headcanons and shipping like... we exist. in real life. yknow. like aros feeling isolated isn't just an online problem. it's not just our flag being in the second part of pride posts or people being obsessed with shipping we have. real life problems.

A lot of countries have tax breaks you can only get when you're married.

It's difficult to afford a good home on a single income.

Single people are less likely to be approved for adoption than couples - and very few places allow you to joint adopt with someone who isn't a romantic partner.

Leaving aside the legal stuff, so many aromantic people have the (not unfounded) fear that their friendships will fall by the wayside because their friends partner up. So many of us are convinced we're going to end up lonely, and we can't even talk about that loneliness without being misinterpreted. No, I'm not afraid that I'll never 'find someone', I'm afraid that all my friends will and then when they do they'll no longer have time for me.

Not to mention how many aro people's friends and family will treat them like there's something wrong with them, like they need to be fixed.

It's not that pride flags and fandom don't matter at all, but our problems are so much bigger and more complex than that.