mouthporn.net
#andrea831 metas caroline – @andreal831 on Tumblr
Avatar

Long Live the Mikaelsons

@andreal831

she/her A blog dedicated to overanalyzing TVDU, but mostly the Mikaelsons, mostly Elijah Mikaelson I post pictures, gifs, updates on my fics, and my opinions on the show.
Avatar
Anonymous asked:

Hi! I love your posts and would like to hear your opinion on this:

Is it just me or does the fandom seem to have different standards between Caroline and the rest of the female characters?

Like, for example, Caroline is allowed to have her flaws (Like being unnecessary mean at times, insensitive slut-shaming, etc) and the fandom praises her and loves her for it. But whenever the any of the other female characters (Elena, Bonnie, Hayley, Liv, etc) behave similarly they’re bashed for it.

This isn’t bashing Caroline, btw. I do like her, this is just something I’ve observed.

First, thank you so much! I'm glad you like my posts <3

Second, I'm going to try and answer this in a way that I offend the least amount of people possible. But remember, these are just my opinions and interpretations of the show. You can like/dislike whatever character you want. My opinion doesn't need to matter to you.

The fandom in general has a lot of misogyny in it and I do think we can blame a lot of it on the writers for encouraging it. But, yes, each of the women in the show are treated very differently for various reasons.

I like Caroline, but I'll talk about my feelings on her more in another post. I know there is a lot of discussion in the fandom of Caroline being a self-insert for JP and it allows others to have her be a self-insert for themselves. Therefore, the fandom tends to be more understand with her because they see themselves in her. I agree with this to an extent. I do think that Caroline is easier for the audience to understand because her problems feel more human. Most people can understand being an insecure teenager or feeling left out by her friends, a girl who has boy drama and fights with her mom. Season 1 really cemented Caroline as the teenage human girl. While Bonnie and Elena were dealing with supernatural problems. While, as an audience, we can appreciate them, we can't fully understand what they were going through.

This plays a part throughout the series for a lot of people. I see fans often forget the struggles of other characters but hold on to Caroline. To me, it's because they related to Caroline on a personal level they just aren't able to do with the others. A lot of girls are watching Caroline struggle through the same issues they are as they are struggling through them. While I don't necessarily think it's in a self-insert type of way, Caroline does represent the average teenage girl, even after she is turned. I don't think this is a problem per se, people will always find ways to relate to a character. It's the point of media.

I hate discussions on who is the better friend between the three because they all have moments where they are amazing friends and moments where they had issues to different extents.

We also can't discuss how everyone is treated without mentioning race. Bonnie is constantly held to a higher standard because of this. As the only black/POC character for the vast majority of the show, Bonnie has to represent the whole community. She's not allowed to be angry or loud or rude because then it furthers stereotypes. And when she is, people jump on these stereotypes and write her off as a character in general to make it seem like it's not just their racism.

Now for the rest of the women, I have seen hate for every single woman on this show get unnecessary hate. Including Caroline. I do think Caroline stans let her slide on a lot and will defend her like their lives depend on it, but so will Katherine stans and Elena stans, etc. We tend to want to see our favorite characters as perfect and any critique is seen as an attack on their choice of favorites instead of just that, a critique. There is not a single character alive that cannot be critiqued.

Caroline sleeping with Klaus after everything he did was wrong. Just like Elena sleeping with Damon after everything he did was wrong. Caroline was wrong for murdering 12 witches to save her friend just as Hayley was wrong for helping get 12 hybrids killed to find her family. These things don't cancel each other out or make one alright.

Bonnie is perfect and has never done anything wrong.

I do think Caroline stans tend to make up a very large and vocal part of the fandom so it does come across that Caroline is allowed to do anything without critique, but I feel like I've seen a shift in the fandom (or maybe just the side I'm on) where she does get called out. And this is coming from someone who has gotten some nasty inbox messages from Care stans. But some of my favorite mutuals are also Care stans. I've seen so many people love the villains but criticize the teenagers for absolutely everything they do. People just want their faves to be perfect and for everyone to love them. Don't let the problematic, toxic stans represent the character or the fandom as a whole.

Thanks for the ask!

Avatar
Anonymous asked:

Your opinion of Caroline?

I will always love Caroline Forbes.

Yes, she was a deeply flawed character for most of the show, but so was everyone. Caroline, Elena, and Bonnie will always be special to me because they were TVDU for so long. I will always love the three of them over any love triangle the show tried to force on us.

But Caroline, to me, felt like a very organic character. She was a stereotypical mean girl in high school who hid her insecurities behind cutting words and a 'I'm too good for this' persona. I loved seeing her grow throughout the show and become a more confident and secure version of herself. I don't think she needed to become a vampire to do this. She just needed some support and maturity.

I adored her development with her mom. Liz wasn't the best mom in the early seasons and it shows how Caroline responded to her. Just the fact that Damon was abusing her in their own home and Liz had no idea. I know Damon is a vampire and could of compelled or snuck around, but she didn't even suspect anything was going on when Caroline was struggling with the abuse. She's a cop. She's supposed to be trained to notice this. But Liz finding out about Caroline being a vampire and coming around to her, loving her and being proud of the person she was. It was so beautiful.

My favorite Caroline ship is honestly Forewood. They were so good to each other. Tyler brought out the best in Caroline and vice versa. Neither of them were the nicest people in season 1 but they grew together. I hated the writers for ruining them. They deserved better. The fact that they didn't even show Caroline mourning Tyler or kicking Damon's ass for killing him will never sit right with me. She loved Tyler and that doesn't just fade because they both moved on. I wish, if they were determined to keep them apart, that we could have at least had their friendship back.

I do love Steroline too and I do tend to hold it out over Forewood just because the ending of Forewood kind of ruined that ship for me. Steroline to me was such a great friend-to-lovers moment. Stefan was another person that brought out the good in Caroline.

I've seen a lot of people say Caroline doesn't have development, but I disagree. Especially in a show where Damon and Klaus are held out to have the "best" development. Do I think she had the greatest development in the history of media, no. Like I said in the beginning, she had a very organic development. She became a more mature person because she got older. I think her relationship with Stefan was a sign of this. Stelena fans love to say Stefan loved Elena first and Caroline was just his second pick, but that's not how love works. The logic sounds like season 1 Caroline. But as their relationship develops, Care no longer has that impulse to question it. She learns to feel secure in the love Stefan has for her, which shows a lot of development from her high school relationships. Although, Caroline had ever right to question Matt who was still very clearly into Elena.

Caroline is a deeply flawed character, much like the entire show. There were definitely storylines that I couldn't stand or phases of writing that I found annoying, but that's every character for me. She definitely can and should be criticized. The biggest examples I can think of that Caroline does something problematic that deserves being called out: her general insensitivity in season 1, sleeping with Klaus, how she treated Tyler after that, her criticizing anyone for turning their humanity off after she easily did so. She's not a perfect character. But I still found her charm and personality to be compelling. She could have been better at times and how they portrayed her in TO and Legacies did hurt her character a lot. But I'm always going to have a soft spot for TVD Caroline.

Thanks for the ask!

Avatar
Anonymous asked:

Do you see Klaus making out with Caroline in Tyler’s body, while she thought it was Tyler, as SA?

100% yes, it's SA.

Consent isn't just about agreeing to be physical with anyone, it is about agreeing with that specific person. Informed consent matters. Caroline was unable to make an informed decision because she didn't have all of the information. She never would have reacted to Klaus that way and he knew it. He used the fact that she didn't know who he was as a way to get close to her. Yes, she initiated it, but, first he definitely had the ability to stop it and second, he also participated.

A lot of the fandom, and even I, like to think that he called her 'love' as a way to let her know who he is so that it wouldn't progress further. I personally don't think he would have done more, but it doesn't make what he did do less problematic. I've also been recently reminded of the scene in Season 5 where he has a naked, dead woman in his bed. So maybe he would have gone further. He has done awful, terrible things, but I still try to believe that is a line he won't fully cross.

Again, it doesn't take away from what he did to Caroline. He SA'd her and didn't even feel remorse about it. In fact, I believe he laughed afterwards. Just another example of TVDU acting like SA is a joke.

Thanks for the ask!

Avatar
Anonymous asked:

Do you think the TVDU lacked female friendships in its shows? Like, I can’t think of any meaningful female friendships in TVD outside of Elena, Bonnie, and Caroline. The women were always either not getting along or had very little interaction.

I think TO was worse when it came to this. Outside of the occasional Hayley/Rebekah, Hayley/Cami scenes, the women didn’t really interact. Though I think this is more so due to TO not really focusing on any relationships that weren’t familial. (And the lack of female characters in general.) Hayley and Freya were the only two female characters who were main characters for the majority of the show, yet their friendship only blossomed offscreen between the s4 and s5 time jump.

While I’m not a fan of Legacies, I think that show definitely did better with this aspect with Hope/Lizzie, Hope/Josie, etc.

Anyway, I love your blog and would love to hear your thoughts on this!

Hi love! I love to discuss female friendships and the lack of them in TVDU.

I feel like the show loved to have these friendships in the background but put almost zero effort into them.

I will always love Bonnie, Elena, and Caroline. I especially loved Bonnie and Caroline's bond after Elena left. Yes, they all had problems and at times weren't the best of friends, but the bond was always there. They were all willing to sacrifice themselves for each other. But the most important aspect of their friendship was the day to day. I loved the little moments of friendship we got throughout the show. There were definitely things I would change and improve but they had the best friendship in the show.

Now, in TO, we get almost nothing. Like I said, we have background friendships, Hayley/Rebekah, Hayley/Cami, Rebekah/Davina, Hayley/Davina, etc. But the show invests almost no time in the friendships. I agree with your point that TO just didn't "waste" time on relationships, romantic or platonic. It is one of my biggest complaints. We hardly got any scenes of just pure friendship. To me, the best TO friendship is Davina and Josh and even that is limited.

In TO, the women tend to revolve around the men because the show revolves around the Mikaelson men, and more specifically Klaus. Even when the women are interacting, they are often interacting because of the men. We finally see a good friendship between women in the later seasons, Hayley and Freya, and as you said, it happens off screen and only after the Mikaelson men are forced out of NOLA.

I do think it would have been different had Claire Holt been able to stay on the show as a main character. Season 1 showed her friendships with Davina and Hayley and I think her and Cami would have bonded quickly. Unfortunately she wasn't able to and the show was still going to revolve around the Mikaelsons. They tried to just pass the relationships onto Freya as Rebekah's replacement, but there was just too much already going on at that point and they were having to build up her relationship with her family (the men) from nothing. Unlike Rebekah who already had established relationships with her brothers. This made Freya's relationships with the other women more strained.

Also, I would be remiss if I don't mention this is another reason Cami's death was so stupid. She was a central figure, uniting the different characters, and had probably the most important relationships with other women.

Honestly, the edits I've seen of Hope, Lizzie, and Josie are the only reason I debate watching Legacies. It seems like the show did a better job of recapturing the TVD friendships and even improved upon it.

Thank you for the ask and for reading my long winded metas <33

Avatar
Anonymous asked:

In regards to your take about Katherine, I do agree with you about Stefan completely, and always put my foot down when it comes to rape and sexual assault. The only gripe I have is when people only call out Katherine for this, but always defend Damon and outright deny he ever raped and abused Caroline, when he literally used the exact same methods that Katherine did on Stefan. But somehow they think that because Caroline was the one who showed interest in Damon first, and that she gave consent only once that it makes her rape and abuse less valid than Stefan's.

Even if Caroline did show interest first and gave consent the first time, it doesn't mean she wasn't allowed to change her mind, after she saw Damon for what he was. And after that first time, she was compelled and couldn't give consent or have a say in the matter. Her autonomy was taken away just the same way Stefan's was. And the amount of victim blaming/shaming and slut shaming I see Caroline get for this, and the amount of excuses they make to defend Damon just because they find him hot and attractive and love the bad boy is just beyond revolting and disgusting to me.

As for everything else, like your points about how they should've shown evidence of that Katherine was living in fear of Klaus, or that Klaus had his own network of vampires to track her down, I agree with that. And this is one of many instances where I chalk it up to a writing flaw rather than a character flaw. Also an example of telling instead of showing, which was the writers biggest flaw on both shows.

I always see people applaud Elena for "being brave" and willing to sacrifice herself and choosing not to run, when the truth is, she shouldn't have been in that kind of a position to begin with. The idea people have that Katherine or Elena owed Klaus anything is absurd to me, because they didn't owe him anything. Neither one of them should've had to sacrifice their own lives and die just for his own selfish cause.

And as much as people blame Katherine for Klaus going after Elena, I really don't think it would've mattered either way. Klaus still would've found Elena, whether Katherine came to Mystic Falls or not, and just taken Elena himself.

TW: Rape/SA

I 100% agree with everything you said.

People are misogynistic when they talk about Katherine and Damon. I absolutely cannot stand season 1 Damon. He was meant to be a villain and was. There is no question that he raped Caroline. It doesn't matter that she was flirting with him or even that she initially wanted to be with him. As soon as she said no and changed her mind, it crosses over to rape. A person is allowed to change their mind at any point for any reason. She very clearly expressed it and Damon ignores it and continues to compel and use her for months.

Season 1 Caroline is why I will always have a soft spot for her, even when she made decisions I didn't like or annoyed me. What she went through at such a young age just broke my heart and I feel like the show never gave her the time to process it or even acknowledge it. Hell, even just having Stefan and Caroline be able to support each other and trauma bond.

I do not allow any slut shaming on my pages for anyone. I do see it a lot with Caroline. People often blanket it in a way that they are trying to defend another character, but it's still not appropriate. It's one thing to say that her having sex with a certain character was problematic, but it's completely different to just shame her for sex in general.

I do also agree that it was a writing flaw in how they portrayed Katherine's past. I indirectly said this in the previous post. I think it really has to do with the fact that they hadn't anticipated keeping the Mikaelsons on for so long. In TO they wanted to make the Mikaelsons look more sympathetic, which would have been harder to do if every flashback showed them mercilessly hunting down Katherine. Unfortunately, this made Katherine look cruel for how she used and abused people in order to stay "hidden." Again, I do headcanon that they had people looking for her and chasing her, but she still did things that weren't necessary and continued to do things she didn't need to even after the Mikaelsons were no longer chasing her.

I also agree that Katherine and Elena owed no one anything, especially not Klaus. I also hate when people blame one character for another's behavior. Katherine attempting to hand Elena over to Klaus, yes we can blame her. But we can't blame Katherine for the inevitability of Klaus seeking Elena out. If anything, like I said in the last post, Katherine could have sold out her ancestors earlier. She was the only one who knew she had a child and that more doppelgangers could have existed. I'm not sure when she discovered the lore of everything, but she did at some point and I like to believe she didn't immediately start trying to sell out her ancestor for her own freedom.

Thanks for the ask!

Avatar

I got a lot of edits on my fyp prior to watching any TVDU show so I knew a solid amount of the plot lines prior to watching either show, which also means I knew what characters were normalized to be hated/loved. I started these shows and expected to absolutely despise Matt, Elena, Tyler, and Cami. None of them are my favorite, but I never understood the hate for any of them whatsoever.

The Matt hate just makes no sense, I’m convinced people just want to “fit in” and hate the person that everyone else hates. You pretty much explained everything I would say for him so I’ll hold back a bit here. And yeah, I’m tired of people pretending he’s not attractive cause there is not a single actor on this show that doesn’t look good.

Everyone calls Elena a crybaby, but if they had lost the amount of people that she had before they’re even 20 years old, I guarantee you they’d be crying even more than she did. And calling her selfish? She very rarely ever put herself over anyone. There’s also the argument that she ‘played Stefan’ which in my opinion is just straight out wrong, it’s not like she was pretending to be in love with him while she was with him, but if you hate her for that, you’d have to hate like half the show. I swear everyone dated everyone within that friend group, why do people only hate on her for it? Also this has nothing to do with my point, but why does everyone hate on her NH era? I liked it, it gave her character something different.

Everyone hates on Tyler for one of two reasons. One being that he tried to SA Vicki in season 1, which you would think is a valid excuse, but then they go onto say Klaus, Damon, and/or Katherine is their favorite character (and I’m saying this as my Damon and Klaus are both in my top 5 TVDU characters). The second reason would be something along the lines of Tyler wanting to get revenge on Klaus. I do think he went too far with trying to kill Hayley/hope, but aside from that, he had every right to get revenge on Klaus. He killed his mom and practically ruined his life, including messing with his relationship with Caroline. I actually love Forewood, but I don’t think they could’ve been endgame after that. So I don’t get why people hate on him for leaving Caroline, because I feel like continuing to lead her on when his head is nowhere near the right space would’ve been worse.

Then there’s cami, which is honestly the most confusing one out of all to me. I completely understand her not being your favorite, especially if you’re into more of the anti heroes or villains (like me), but I do not understand why people just absolutely despise her. She plays a major part in the originals, especially early on, as she is the only person Klaus seems to care about listening to whatsoever. He isn’t paying Hayley any sort of attention, and he lied to/betrayed Elijah left and right in season 1. She’s also never betrayed anyone that she considers to be friends or family. The biggest reason she’s hated on is because she ‘stole Klaus from Caroline.” 1. I genuinely just do not get what people see in klaroline. I don’t absolutely despise them, but I do not like them either. Klaus hurt her multiple times (which, by the way, why do people act like Klaus is a hero for saving Caroline from a bite he caused…?) and Caroline was manipulating him every chance she got. I totally understand the whole ‘enemies to lovers’ trope, considering I like delena, but I just do not get it here. 2. How did anyone see that Klaus (and the originals) was getting his own show, and still expect klaroline to work out? 95% of interactions they had post TO being made was complete fan service. It would’ve been WAY too difficult to do a long distance thing with two different shows, especially when neither of them were (im so gonna get hated for this) never in love with each other, they weren’t even in a relationship. Oh and back to the forewood thing real quick, Tyler had every right to be pissed at Caroline for sleeping with Klaus.

Well that turned into a klaroline bashing towards the end. For the record my top 5 characters are Damon, Elijah, kol, hayley, and Klaus in that order and there really aren’t any ships (canonical ships anyway) that I absolutely hate so.

Side note, thank you for being able to hold characters accountable. I like characters as villains/anti heroes because they are a villain/anti hero, I will never understand why people try to defend their favorite character and make them seem like a hero. Like the character for their character, don’t make them into something completely different. If you wanna debate anything further (or something entirely different) let me know, I enjoy debating about shows, I just typically can’t find anyone in this fandom (or any fandom for that matter) that is able to have an actual debate without someone starting to scream over an opinion lmao.

There really isn’t a question here I just kinda felt like ranting after reading your post about Matt Donovan so here it is. Reply to this as you please!

Avatar

I was fortunate enough to watch the shows before I got into the fandom so I didn't get spoilers (at least for TVD), but more importantly, I didn't have anyone to influence me on which characters to like or not. Which was why I was so surprised when I joined the fandom and saw so much hatred. But I do think some people just "bandwagon" hate characters. Especially Matt. Because anytime I ask people why, they can't even truly express why they *hate* him.

Elena was never my favorite character but I loved early seasons of Elena. I even enjoyed her NH era. I didn't like her sire bond era much. But she definitely gets too much hate. Even at times when I think she can be selfish, she's still miles better than the men the fandom loves.

I've actually posted about Tyler before, you can find that here. Sure, he's done questionable/problematic things, but who hasn't? The hate he gets is ridiculous, especially because it always comes from Damon or Klaus stans. I actually like Caroline and adored Forewood, but I hated how she handled the breakdown of their relationship. I blame the writers. They continuously tanked Caroline's character in order to get views with klaroline.

I love Cami and she is the one character that I truly believe has done no wrong. Cami was truly a turning point for Klaus. Cami was not only an important person for Klaus but for the entire Mikaelson family and the entirety of New Orleans. I also wrote about that recently. But yes, 100% of the hate she gets is because of Klaroline stans. I used to be indifferent to Klaroline. Like I don't like them because they are toxic and I would never ship them, and there are plenty of ships I feel this way about, but the fandom has made me actively dislike them. Klaroline had no possible way of working out and was just lust, but people build them up in their head and then attacked and harassed a real life person because of their delusions.

I'm glad you found my post and enjoyed it! I love finding people that want to engage and have actual discussions about the fandom. Too many people get so set in their views and can't discuss the characters without getting angry. I completely agree. We can all love the characters but 99% of the characters in this show are problematic to say the least. We can love them and still acknowledge this. I love to analyze the morality of the show because it is interesting as we can't use are real life standards to do so. I obviously love over analyzing everything about the show as I spend so much time doing so.

Feel free to ask anything or reach out!

Avatar
Anonymous asked:

Are there any characters/ships (in any movie/show) that you dislike almost entirely due to fans?

This lowkey feels like a setup lmao.

There are characters and ships that I stopped caring about because of toxic fandoms, but I don't think it's ever entirely due to fans. There is usually deeper reasons I don't like them and the fans just make it worse.

For instance, if you have been on any of my pages, you know I don't like klaroline. I want to preface this with saying, just because I say I don't like a ship, doesn't mean I am saying no one can like them. This is my opinion, everyone is entitled to their opinions. I actually liked klaroline my very first watch through of TVD when I was younger, but after that, I didn't see the appeal. This was all long before I was aware of the fandom and found out the some of the stans were actually threatening a real life person and got her fired from her job. I have since had my own life experience which make it impossible for me to like any ships that involve physical violence. I am never going to like a ship where one of the characters has physically harmed/tried to kill the other. So it has less to do with the fans than my own perception. That being said the fans don't help.

I really liked Caroline throughout my time in the fandom, but seeing people get personally attacked because of any perceived critique just makes me not want to interact with that side of the fandom. It doesn't mean I don't still like her. I just don't make contact revolving her and she subsequently gets moved lower on my list of favorites because I just don't spend time thinking about her. I also personally love to criticize even my favorite characters. If the fans are unable to do that, I won't post about them because I just don't feel like dealing with it.

This is not an exhaustive list, but it does tend to be the stans that I personally see get the most aggressive. I have also interacted with wonderfully nice and compassionate Klaroline/Caroline stans. It's always upsetting when the toxic minority ruins it for everyone.

I will say, to me the actors are much more likely to make me dislike their character a lot more than the fandom. For instance, very early in the fandom I saw terrible posts from Nate Buz just being an awful human, so I was just never able to see the appeal of Kol. I know people say to "separate the actor for the character," but to me this only goes one way. You should never hold a character against an actor, but I am going to hold the actor against the character. It doesn't matter what compelling role Nate Buz plays, I just can't stand even hearing him speak.

I know you asked about other fandoms but this is the only fandom I really got into well enough to feel the effects of the toxic stans. I was apart of the Harry Potter fandom for a while, but toxic fans only served to make me stop interacting, not dislike any characters. And the main reason I stopped was because JKR came out as a terrible human. Same thing with Twilight.

Every fandom is going to have toxic people. That's just life. I try to avoid it and interact with people who are excited to have positive interactions. But seeing the toxicity is upsetting. It won't make me completely dislike a character but I will hesitate to interact with that side of the fandom and naturally move away from that character.

Also I know there are characters I post about that have toxic stans as well, but I tend to see them less. I don't know if there are less people or if I'm just in a safe bubble. I would love if people could just be nice to each other and accept that we don't all view characters the same way.

Thanks for the ask!

Avatar

TVDU needs a more diverse representation of feminine strength

Can we leave behind this idea that woman have to exhibit stereotypical masculine traits to be "badass"?

We see this with nearly ever female character in TVDU. While, yes, there are women who have these traits naturally, TVDU forces this idea that femininity is bad and every woman responds to trauma or grows as a character by adopting masculine traits. This is referred to as the "tomboy" trope. We often see the feminine characters portrayed as naïve or ditzy and the masculine characters as strong and brave.

We have these characters in the beginning of the show that are nice, gentle, caring, all these things that we associate with femininity. But when they "grow" as a character, the become cruel, harsh, and selfish. They become their male counterparts.

Again, this isn't saying that woman are not just as capable of these traits as the men, they are. It's also not saying that all men behave this way. And there is nothing wrong with mixing and matching traits and characters, however, we need to see more diversity shown in a positive light. I wanted to see the show glorify more strong "girly" female characters or even strong, feminine men. We see Stefan tend to exhibit more compassionate traits, but he is often mocked for it or it is shown as a reaction to his addiction, rather than a natural way for men to behave.

Katherine is a great example of women taking on more "masculine" tendencies. While she may have started out exhibiting strong feminine qualities when she was human, her fighting to survive made her leave behind her feminine qualities and adopt more masculine ones. We also have to acknowledge how naïve they portrayed Katherine as a human. She was not only kind and compassionate, but easily manipulated by Klaus. We don't see the cunning woman that we see in present time. But this can make sense since she had five hundred years to harden. We don't see her go through it all, but the way she talks about her life, the audience can understand how she changed. The writers saw how much people loved Katherine and really just said copy/paste. All of the women go through so much that they just keep applying this same formula to each of them.

Elena essentially becomes Katherine for a few seasons. I love early seasons of Elena and then the very end when she turns human again. But as a vampire, she loses, ironically, so much of her humanity. The thing that made her character special. She was a caring person and her friends and family were her whole world. She wanted to be a doctor and save people and help those around her. She didn't want to harm anyone or be cruel. But as a vampire, she becomes so wrapped up in her personal life that she neglects everything else. She compromises her morals over and over again and you see her becoming Katherine at a much quicker rate. It's also worth noting how often Elena's autonomy is stripped away from her as a human versus the independence she can only seem to get by being a stereotypical vampire.

I know the writer's racism is the reason we didn't see Bonnie go down this path because they didn't want to give her a main storylines. If they had, they likely would have done the exact same thing, because it was all they knew how to do with women. But I love that Bonnie was always a caring person. Yes, it was frustrating to watch people take advantage of her, which they often do with caring characters. But it was refreshing to see her fight against the stereotype of needing to be a selfish, angry person in order to be a badass. She was an amazing, strong character and it was rooted in her compassion. Most of the women, in TVD specifically, have periods where I just don't like the characters, but Bonnie never does. And she isn't given enough credit for actually standing up for herself. But because she does it in a compassionate way, it is overlooked. Bonnie set healthy boundaries, rather than cutting people off or trying to kill them. She was the humanity of the entire show.

Bonnie and Cami to me play the same role in the show. They are the moral compass for the audience. They help remind the audience that the vampires are still the bad guys even if they are the main characters. While I understand Cami's vampire era, I hated that they made her go "dark." We've already seen this way of dealing with trauma. I would have loved to see someone handle their trauma in a healthy way. The show seemed to think the only way to handle life was to get angry and hard. They essentially try to push Cami to be more like Klaus. Whether this is because they felt like she needed to be more "badass" to be with Klaus or because they were attempting to turn the audience against her, I don't know. But they took a character who's strength came from her hope in humanity and twisted her to be just another angry vampire.

I also find it interesting that no one says Klaus or Vincent were trying to "change" Cami by reminding her of who she was before like they do with Stefan and Elijah. But that's another post.

A woman doesn't need to shed her femininity in order to be strong and independent. Masculine traits should not be the only ones we value. (I could write another post on how the men are seen as lesser when they exhibit more feminine traits)

We see bits of this with Rebekah in TO. We start seeing more of a compassionate side of her come out. But a lot of it is shown as her being naïve. They belittle her for still fighting for love after all of this time instead of showing the strength it takes to still be able to want to find love after being hurt so many times. She is vulnerable with Marcel and he uses it to figure out where her family is. Anytime she is respected by the other characters, and even the fandom, it's when she is ripping people' hearts out. We also can't talk about Rebekah without talking about how, when women turn into vampires, they are concerned about having children, but we don't see the same conversation with men.

And don't even get me started on the "crazy ex-girlfriend" trope that they reduce even the strongest women down to (Katherine, Qetsiyah, Rebekah, Aurora, Celeste, etc.)

Hayley is a little different because she is introduced in the show and "she's not like other girls." I think a bit of it is she is older and not into the "teen drama." But either way, she was introduced as a tomboy. I do like that they bring out her more feminine sides at times, but it is usually followed up with someone taking advantage of her. I've talked about it a lot, but her autonomy is constantly being stripped away. Anytime she shows any kind of vulnerability, she is immediately stripped of her own rights.

I haven't watched Legacies, but I did watch a few episodes of season 1. I thought they had done a better job of diverse femininity. Hope seems gentle and kind, Josie really plays into her femininity, while Lizzie was feminine but had strong "masculine" traits. But based on the edits/clips I've seen, Josie leaves the show and Lizzie and Hope both just become mini Klauses.

I would have loved to just see a strong woman who never had to compromise who they are and still survive. I really think Bonnie is the only one. This isn't to say there aren't problems with how Bonnie's character is depicted. There are many. The amount of times women in the show, specifically Bonnie, has to sacrifice their very lives for men to survive is ridiculous. I just love that she never had to adopt stereotypically masculine traits in order to survive or be seen as strong. She gained respect because of her love and compassion.

I also purposefully didn't talk about Caroline because I think she is a difficult character to nail down on what her underlying personality is. She is similar to Lizzie where she appears very feminine with strong "masculine" traits. I think a lot of this gets lost in the writing. She tends to be used as plot devises for the men, rather than being her own character in her own storylines. But just the fact that the fandom hates "insecure, human" Caroline and say it's a good thing Katherine killed her says enough about how the fandom views teenage girls and women.

Avatar
Anonymous asked:

Do you think hating Caroline and not Damon is directly related to misoginy? Personaly i don't but i've seen a lot of people claim that and i think it's a stupid take

I don't think one necessarily has to do with the other.

I think there are a lot of people who hate Caroline for misogynistic reasons. While I also know people don't like her for legitimate reasons. It really comes down to why. Caroline and Damon are not similar characters at all so liking one and not the other could just come down to personal taste.

Now people who love Damon and not Katherine have me really questioning if it's misogynistic because they are essentially the same character. I personally don't like either of them.

Now if I see someone say they don't like Caroline because she's 'bitchy' but then talk about loving Damon, I'll probably push back on that because Damon is the definition of 'bitchy.' People often like to use misogynistic language to talk about Caroline, and honestly a lot of the women in the show. So I do think there are a lot of double standards. But you have to know more about why they like or dislike a character before you can just decide it's misogyny.

Avatar
Anonymous asked:

What do you think Elijah thinks of Klaroline?

He doesn't. I don't think he even knew Caroline existed or really cared to know. And there wasn't really anything for him to know or to think about.

The Originals were one of the best parts of TVD but they honestly never belonged in TVD as anything other than villains. Klaus and Rebekah can be immature and fit in with teenagers at times, but Elijah never had a desire to hang out with high schoolers or give them the time of day.

You are using an unsupported browser and things might not work as intended. Please make sure you're using the latest version of Chrome, Firefox, Safari, or Edge.
mouthporn.net