there’s nothing more agonizing than thinking about all the casual ways dean flirted with cas. the way dean always got up close into cas’ space or the subtle ways he reaches out to brush against cas, calling cas things like devastatingly handsome and sunshine, their phone calls and movie nights and inside jokes. and this whole time. this. whole. time. cas didn’t know dean was flirting. didn’t know it was mutual. that dean was spelling it out for cas in a different way than cas was spelling it out for dean. but they both flirted in their own ways

Some thoughts on Jensen and Destiel and Dean’s bisexuality (with a bit of Misha thrown in)

Q: How come Dean’s allowed to have a crush on Dr. Sexy MD, and yet Destiel and his bisexuality aren’t canon?

[x]

Jensen Ackles, when asked a question posed to him by fans clearly wanting to piss him off, because the question is on a topic he has explicitly stated he does not want to engage with, denies Destiel, but stays clear of denying Dean’s bisexuality. 

Funny. I mean, not funny hah-hah, more like funny intriguing.

I don’t know about you, but to me it’s clear how a will-they-won’t-they love story that’s been built for going on a decade would probably suffer from both actors involved in it confirming it.

Misha started out talking rather openly about how Destiel is an intentional part of the narrative - almost going so far as to get pissy about how this was even a question, if rumours are to be believed - then less openly, until he, as early as last year, was scuttling around the Destiel question like it was on fire. Why? I would venture a complete guess and say that it’s most likely to do with all the negativity thrown his way whenever he’s engaged with it, accusations of queerbaiting flying at him and the show, when this couldn’t be farther away from what they’ve actually been doing all these years, delivering a narrative the likes of which has never been seen on television before.

So, yeah, Misha started out really not getting why he’d have to lie or skirt the topic of there being a M/M love story built on SPN (because I think he thought that’s a bullshit approach and why shouldn’t they be open about them being pro LGBTQ etc) but has grown to realise that he can’t confirm shit because:

a) he contractually can’t discuss any details of what that confirmation actually means for the characters or the show 

b) being vaguely confirmative on the topic only causes severe upset among the fandom and he doesn’t want to be responsible for it

(that’s ^^^ from Dec 2016 btw) (part of this fantastic onset interview)

So Misha will tease in his own sadistic little way, of course, but he appears to have grown to take this stuff pretty seriously, by the looks of his changed attitude over the years. In the later years either he’ll flat out state that he knows the Destiel question causes upset and so he steers clear of it, or he’ll just generally avoid answering the question, talking circles around it and then finding an excuse to get the hell off the stage, for good reason. 

All this while the above, often only half-quoted, panel moment of Jensen’s is delivered by an actor who is portraying a bisexual character and, I wouldn’t be surprised, wishes he could come out and say it loud and proud, but can’t, because it would effectively ruin Dean’s finely crafted character journey for the audience. Jensen confirming Dean’s bisexuality would put a serious dampener on the revelation to the GA that the whole point of SPN is the deconstruction of the Masculine Ideal, the Cowboy, the Manly Man’s Man.

Why would it put a dampener? Because how do you change an idea? How do you make an argument against something that is deeply ingrained in the mindset of millions of people? You start out by agreeing, by enforcing that idea, by going to great lengths to create a world reflecting that idea - only to slowly move away from that idea (or go genitals on full display, either way works) because the idea you actually want to reinforce is the opposite of what has been so deeply ingrained. 

Simply put, SPN was never about glorifying the Male Hero or the Masculine Stereotype, it was always about pointing out how we are not our gender, our sexuality, our race, our age, our cultural heritage, our body type - we are all people first. And we do not judge others and we are not ourselves judged by this bullcrap for any other reason than the societal norm dictating to us what we should find acceptable, and us accepting being dictated to. SPN is about freedom from this preconceived notion that anyone can tell us who to be, it’s about self-liberation. 

Aka no one can tell you who you are, you’re born with the ability to make that choice for yourself - and it isn’t who you are, but what you do, that defines you.

By making Dean Winchester a strong, badass, kick-the-door-down-to-save-a-life hero with many, many softer sides to him that makes him human and relatable, the SPN writers and Jensen himself have given us someone who can call bullshit on the hypocrisy of loving him only if he is straight and fits with what the norm has labeled acceptable masculine behaviour. 

When Dean and Cas get together it’s going to blow such a big fucking hole in that argument because Dean will still be Dean - he will still be exactly the same amount of strong, badass, kick-the-door-down-to-save-a-life hero that he’s always been: he just happens to also have a lot of softness to him that he’s gotten very good at suppressing, and he just happens not be straight. 

Because he is bi. And he is in love with a man.

In January of this year, as the panel at the top of this post is being held, Jensen does what he can to avoid straight up lying about his own portrayal of Dean Winchester, and I’d venture another guess and say he does it because he loves Dean, he knows Dean, he fucking lives Dean, and Dean knows he’s bi. Meaning what? Meaning Jensen likes this fire stoked, perhaps? This reading of Dean having a crush on Dr. Sexy. Because people seeing bi!Dean means that Jensen’s choices as an actor are actually shining through. 

As far as Jensen actually being “uncomfortable” with the Destiel question goes ————————>

Does not look all that uncomfortable teasing Dean and Cas to me, at least not in the context of being relaxed and flirtatious with his costar and friend on stage. I mean, the last of these gifs is from JiB8. Held in May of this year. Six months after the dismissal of the Destiel question. Could there be a reason for these conflicting impressions of how Jensen handles Destiel overall? Hmmmm.

Jensen Ackles is a professional actor - the whole “he relates too much to Dean and this subtly implies that he is such a homophobic human being that he would never be ok with Dean being anything but straight” argument needs to be dropped to the bottom of the deepest darkest ocean and forgotten for all eternity. (please with a thank you on the side) 

And, sure, it’s easy to blow the “just to stoke that fire a little bit” comment off as a joke (made at a panel where he’s in the middle of debunking the Destiel as even remotely viable……..) but at the end of the day… 

Well, I say day - of course I mean series.

There will be such lovely blues and purples and pinks, my lovelies! All the way.

some clarification

re: my post on the jimmy/heaven ending that apparently has now been also reposted on twitter.  sigh.  I mean thats fine, good for yall for crediting me but also SIGH PLEASE. I dont need mish to perceive the discourse.  

just to be clear, misha never said he agreed with this as an ending.   SPECIFICALLY, my question was about his mention of scripts he wanted to see as part of cas’s story in the show that never got done/written (my intention was to nudge him to a different scenario; but I think he took it as a question about the OG ending that got changed) ->

therefore, I think his recounting of the OG jimmy arc and his thoughts on wanting to do it because it would be tragic was in the context of a story that was already written in respect to Dean being in heaven scenario.

within those parameters, if Dean was inevitably going to be in heaven -  his heaven NEEDING to include Cas, and the fact that the person Dean thought was Cas, and was happy to have there - ending up as Jimmy - is tragic. it’s tragic because Dean reciprocated.  

For everyone who chose to hate on Misha: stop. And just chill. I reckon that they would still try to go will-they-won’t-they, and leave the part if Dean found Cas “open for interpretation”. Point is Destiel is no doubt canon and reciprocated in Misha’s head.

I wanted to mention that pitch for the finale was first thing known to the cast. It was not negotiable. It became last season’s constant. And one cannot change that, one can only work around it and try to make it better.

There is a possibility that the thought about another, widely different version of the finale didn’t even cross Misha’s mind.

Yes *points the the above* this is the very thing. And I haven’t seen any other posts than the two I’ve now reblogged on this subject, but my first impression of the post below this one is exactly what OP is clarifying here. And it feels like Misha saying last night that the mixtape was full of rock ballad love songs etc goes to this as well, you know? And I think it’s interesting because Dean’s feelings for Cas isn’t something Misha has really talked about or hinted at that much in the past. Jokingly, sure, and I guess there’s still brevity here, but there’s a different sense of gravitas to the conversation now, and I do believe he’s aware of that. *fingers crossed*

And let’s all look at the facts clear-eyed and bushy tailed and be okay with how Dean was always meant to end up in Heaven. This was Dabb’s vision from a while back, right? And we can talk about why until the cows come home without actually landing on a proper answer because I doubt we’ll ever know for sure if it was just Dabb wanting it tragic or circumstances necessitating a tragic ending or both just happily-tragically walking hand in hand, but no matter the way: textual Destiel was never a go.

We got a semi-nod rather than a great big nod, but the semi-nod was still powerful af, because the subtext of 15x19+20 cemented that Dean’s progression has always been reliant on Cas a helluva lot more than it has on Sam and Cas’ presence in Heaven is a reward that is now left open to interpretation, rather than being underlined as having a tragic note to it.

And this all makes sense of Misha’s comments about how Cas is probably off somewhere in non-corporeal form doing angel stuff (I’m paraphrasing) that I’ve heard from him once or twice since the finale, because that’s the ending that he has in his head for Cas. 

Not the ending I have in my head for Cas, but that’s neither here nor there. :P

Please don’t send hate to people, people. Not only is it bad form, it’s entirely counterproductive. I’m grateful to Misha for doing what he’s always done, delivering tongue-in-cheek comments and trying to supply everyone with some form of closure and him erasing the lingering question marks--even if it’s not official statements of this is exactly how it was etc--is still better than gaping holes in the narrative surrounding the final three eps, yeah? I think so, anyway.

you all lost sight of what the jackles longcon actually is it was a separate entity entirely from the post-finale silence and why am I typing this. why am I typing this. what am I SAYING oh god I think I’m breaking free of the witch’s curse I’ve been under for months

I’ve been sucked back into turbo hell, and feelings have been reawakened that need expressing.

i am so glad that he genuinely wants to know

SPN did Market Research for Dean & Cas

Disclaimer: Yes this is a sock for safety reasons. Post is long, but please read it.

No shit there I was checking my email, as you do, and I saw I had a screener from one of the market research groups I’m signed up with.  On average, I do a market research thing every 3-4 months because I like non-reportable money. And giving my opinions. And talking to people behind 2 way mirrors without having to go to a police station.   

Market research itself was early December, 2016. First email contact with the screener was late October or early November. 

I see it’s an “offsite,” meaning a market research company is subcontracted by another company who wants to do the market research at their own facility, but doesn’t want to find the participants on their own, so they use the Market research company (in this case Schlesinger and Associates) as an intermediary. I can’t remember if this screener identified itself as being for TV, not all do, some might identify only as entertainment, and some might be even more vague until you get into the screener. Regardless of the identification for the screener (TV or entertainment), I fill out almost every screener I receive unless it’s obvious, from the subject, they won’t want me (ie looking for certain types of professionals)- it didn’t matter, then, if the subject matter was something I particularly like, I would’ve filled it out anyway.  

After normal, but more detailed than usual demographics questions, the screener asked about TV habits. Eventually,  it said the word “fandom” and asked what TV fandoms I’d count myself in.  It was roughly a list of 20 shows and listed “fandom” (defined as I watch every episode and read additional materials about the show. Note this is not what fandom itself would consider fandom, but people most fandom dwellers would still count as GA).  Beyond fandom, one could indicate they: watch all episodes but don’t seek out more,  watch most episodes, have seen some episodes, watched a few, or haven’t watched.  (I just got a screener for soap operas and realized that part was the same and made note). Therefore, fandom, to corporate, are people who watch everything and maybe buy some swag for the show- magazines/shirts. Then, they asked about conventions I might have attended.  And then asked about my dream vacation, so I babbled a lot about my dream to go to SDCC (I hadn’t at this point). Supernatural was on the list of shows, so I made sure I answered the essay questions about it, because why not? It was my favorite of what was listed.  It was a long screener. I don’t remember the rest. Though sometimes I might remember a detail if a screener reminds me of it. Most fun screener I’ve filled out.

A few days/weeks later, I got a call for step 2- the phone screener for the people that sounded good when filling out the form. And where they try and make sure your answers match or fit that same person who answered them. I passed step 2, and was told there would be homework, and asked ifI’d have time for it, since I would only have so many days to watch the assigned material and write essays about them. 

Homework arrives: I have to watch and write essays on all the bonus features of Supernatural S10. There might’ve been something in there from another year, too. And all the bonus features from some season of  Big Bang Theory.  Essays for all of it, too.  And I mean essays, not short answers.  It was like the SATs, and I was analyzing blooper reels (among other things).  I still don’t get why they wanted essay questions on blooper reels, but I’ll always happily write one again cause that was the funniest essay to have to write! 

I had to both print and bring and email all my answers ahead of time.  I did not keep them.  I’m honestly curious what I might’ve written.  

So in December, I get to go to WB’s market research department. Fun fact: the entrance to that building faces what had recently been the Supernatural poster. I check in. At this point I think it’s a group. Because most market research is done in groups. Also they said I was there for the “DVD bonus features study” 

I wait in the lobby, but I’m surprised there seem to be very few others around. I don’t think I got there too early, but all the others were taken back before me. And they didn’t seem to be there for the same study.  Oh and I wore business casual clothes but had some show-based earrings for fun.  

Finally a nice lady brings me back to a room. She turns off the lights and gives me a fancy remote and has me play with a new system for watching bonus features. I had to start with BBT. Then we did something else. Then I was allowed to scroll through and I picked Supernatural, and answered all the things.  By this point I figured I would be released soonish   because I was supposed to be there only for an hour. And this was at least half an hour at the most. No clock, though and cell phone off.  Maybe this part went faster than I remember, but it was less interesting so it felt longer? Or less interesting compared to what came next. 

Keep reading

Please, this will be one of the most important reads of your time in fandom. We can finally talk about it. Now this whole entire fandom can know that we were fought for, that we weren’t the only ones that believed destiel was a story worth telling. It’s just a shame we lost the fight.

“Of course I forgive you.”

————————-

I didn’t actually see the episode, but I assume this is what happened, right? 

(Just a very quick sketch because feels) 

————————–> Buy me a Kofi? 

Sam & Eileen hugging parallels ⇢ 12x17 | 15x06

Their bio on the website 😹

Why did dabb's assistant tweet this why did she tweet this

Being in a room with straight people talking about straight things is so exhausting.

What the hell are ‘straight things’?

Marriages and mortgages and families and opposite sex attraction talk and talking about sex openly without being made to feel like you are making people uncomfortable and hearing straight people talk about how hard dating is for them and hearing straight people talk about how they are such victims and their lives are shit when what this really means is they aren’t married at age 22 and sexist crap that drives me crazy like traditional weddings and how great religion is and how the world is so lovely and kind and great because people don’t know what it’s like to be a minority and how straight people are like “this person is so lovely” when you know they are homophobic or listening to straight people say things are “gay” or talk about people who dress unconventionally (ie. men who wear dresses) as being weird or doing impressions of gay people or asking “why don’t you have a boyfriend?” judgementally as if it is just that easy or getting annoyed at you when you complain about how hard your life is because it’s easy for them cause they are straight and wouldn’t know the first thing about it or having to come out to people all the time cause they just assume you’re straight and getting weird looks like “tmi” or “you don’t look gay” or “I don’t care what you do in the bedroom” or having to hear straight people talk about really cute straight couples or really great romantic films or books about straight people or just watching people live super conventional lives and do really sexist old fashioned things just because no one is brave enough to question or think about anything… and worst of all knowing that if you were to say or talk about anything gay everyone would get uncomfortable and not join in on the conversation and wish you had said nothing… and then people will be like “you hardly said anything”, “you’re so quiet”, “you don’t talk much”, “are you shy”, “you’re boring”.

No bitch I’m gay and I don’t relate to nor am I really interested in any of the shit that you have been yelling to my face for the last hour.

I live for the number of straight people that don’t understand why this was written in this way.

It’s exhausting reading this right? Well that’s what’s it’s like for us gay people to have to listen to straight people’s opinions on things over and over and over

14x01 - Stranger in a Strange Land