@aborddelimpala / aborddelimpala.tumblr.com
From Misha Collins virtual panel today [source]. I wonder what that ending could have been. I imagine Cass waiting for Dean in Heaven, telling him to follow the road & find Sam, like in Swan Song. On another note, I’m glad that the covid situation (2 weeks mandatory quarantine) prevented to bring back shitload of old characters. The finale was just about the bros and I’m very grateful for it.
Firstly, let’s talk about why Sam lived. It was because when Dean was dying, he asked Sam to promise him that it was okay, not to bring Dean back, and Sam gotta keep living and fighting. That was the only way for Dean to keep on being with Sam in his heart, in every step that Sam would make. Sam simply lived because it was Dean’s request, his death will.
However, living without Dean was almost impossible for Sam. He had been struggling for a long time, isolating himself from the world. Everything in the bunker reminded him of Dean and he was living like a walking dead and had been crying for awhile. Until he got a call from work, he decided to leave the bunker.
When he left, Sam brought Dean’s duffel instead of his back bag. He left everything behind except for things that reminded and contained Dean’s memory.
After that, Sam got a son and he named him Dean Jr. Normally, we all knew that it should be Dean who names his son Dean Jr in case he got a son. However, Sam used this name for his own son. Naming your son after your dead brother proved that he very needed a Dean in his life. And Dean Jr became Sam’s living reason.
Speaking of those photos in Sam’s house, most of them were photos of Sam and Dean together. There was no photo of Sam’s wife or partner. Later, there was some of Dean Jr’s photos but they were just a few. Sam hung on life by creating a new family, naming his own son Dean Jr, but the real Dean had never been replaced by any of that. He held onto the new life, but he could never get rid of Dean’s picture in his mind.
Sam still kept Baby. At this moment, Sam was pretty old, but he still couldn’t hold back his tears when he sat in the Impala. Because it was where Sam and Dean call home, where their journey began. The empty feeling inside of Sam had always been there. As if it was “a stormy sea of moving emotion” and Sam got “tossed about”, “like a ship on the ocean”. After all those years, Sam could never stop feeling in pain when he thought about Dean.
When Sam was in his death bed, Dean Jr came to him, put his hand on Sam’s and told Sam it was okay, he could go now. They were exactly those words that Sam had told Dean to comfort him when his brother had been dying. And when the time came, Sam needed those exact words from a Dean to comfort a Sam. Sam, at his time of dying, was still carrying Dean’s watch as if it was their memory object, a symbol of his brother.
Sam walked right to Dean when he was in Heaven. Why didn’t Sam look old like he was supposed to be? He died old, not young, right? I have been wondering since I watched that scene. Until I realized that Heaven is where your soul lives. And the fact that Sam looked exactly the same as when Dean had died showed that even when Sam lived such a long apple pie life, his soul had actually died right at the moment Dean passed away.
In conclusion, Sam has always been alive, but he couldn’t actually live ever since that night.
-Perry-
And..... my heart broke all over again 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭
When Jensen said in a panel that he required some time to wrap his head around the ending do you think he meant that he wasn’t happy with the brothers dying separately? Do you think you wanted a similar end for both the brothers?Because hellers are using this statement of his against the ending which they clearly weren’t happy with. They’re saying that Jensen wasn’t happy because cas wasn’t mentioned. also how do you feel about the ending?
Answer to your first question
Also, it wasn’t a nail, it was a nasty rebar made from reinforced steel.
Not surprisingly the hellers are too dense to understand Jensen’s reaction and assumed it’s all about their stupid fake ass ship and a side character.
Even I was shocked that Dean was killed so early in the episode, Dabb got mega balls to pull that off. I don’t blame Jensen’s initial reaction, Dean is a memorable character when he’s with Sam and to sideline him like that is matter of pride. But in the bigger picture it works becaue Sam has to have his shot at an apple pie life otherwise he’s not a complete person.
Dean would never retire from the hunting life. Even when Michael gave him a fantasy life complete with owning a bar, Dean still conjured up monsters in his bar so he can fight and kill them. To put it bluntly, as long as Dean is alive, Sam will never be free to pursue a non-hunting life. Is why Dean made his speech back in season 8 telling Sam to have his normal life after Dean dies with a gun in his hand and a smile on his face.
The second issue I think Jensen had was the finale concluded Sam & Dean’s story, there’s no more to tell and therefore no future Sam & Dean limited series or movie. There can always be more SPN spinoff attempts with new hunters or Sam’s son. I think that’s what Jensen was talking about producing Supernatural reboot or spinoff with his company.
I’m not being funny but the actual incest shippers are seeing way less incest in the ending than other people who are into shipping Dean and Cas or from other fandoms. Supernatural has effectively criticised and then accidentally PROVED that there is some level of toxic masculinity and expectation attached to straight men in society that shouldn’t be there any more.
If the only possible way you can interpret Sam and Dean’s love is ‘incest’ then it says more about you than about the show. Even Wincest shippers know that, why is this fandom like this though honestly? This is the craziest situation I’ve ever seen. Like the only shippers who are totally chill and fun and understood the plot are the incest shippers? Seriously? Wild! Lol
What did you think of 15x20? It actual made me cry it was so good. Did it surprise you or go like you thought it would?
“Carry On” finale was very good, with each rewatch it gets even better and over time I think it will be one of the greatest tv show finale. It is the best ending for Sam and Dean and a love letter to long time loyal fans.
It surprised me so no, it didn’t go the way I thought it would. Mainly because I didn’t think Sam woud actually get to have his apple pie life. The show has always made it clear that hunting was a job for Sam, not part of his identity like it is for Dean. That was reiterated briefly this season in “Drag Me Away” when the blond woman asked Sam if he wants normal, Sam deflected by giving a rote response that they save lives, there was no passion in his words. The same episode showed us flashbacks of young Sam yearing for a different life away from hunting.
I remember thinking they want to keep showing us that this isn’t the life Sam would choose for himself but what’s the point? Sam is never going to get his normal life when he and Dean are going to die together in the finale saving the world. If anything it makes us more sad for Sam and that’s not nice.
Boy was I wrong, and I’m glad for it.
this is no question, but God, after watching the finale I couldn't stop thinking about how right you were all along. About Sam being the main protagonist, dean being his best when referring to Sam I mean thaT BaRn ScenE oh my god, he only talked about how amazing Sam is, and it was perfect, beautiful heartbreaking. You were also right about Sam girls getting the last laugh. So I guess I wanted to thank you for enlighting me with your capacity of understanding the show
I’m always up for getting high-five validations from you all, so thank you Anon.
The barn scene was genius, IMO, bringing the series to full circle with callback to the pilot, fleshing it out, adding backstory to Dean’s pov that brings his fear, need, relief, and love to stark relief. It hurt like hell, and at the same time, cathartic because Dean was brutally honest.
The way Dean said, “Come here. Let me look at you. There he is!” That’s Dean in dad mode, the parental figure to Sam. They told/remind the audience in 15x18 that Dean raised his little brother. Still in dad mode, Dean then tells Sam that he is proud of him. It’s what every son wants to hear from their dad.
Dean then goes into brother mode and tells Sam he admires his strength even when they were children. Sam’s strength is such that Dean was afraid that Sam doesn’t need him. Fearing rejection, he stood outside of Sam’s dorm for hours before finally going to Sam because it’s always been Sam and Dean, and Dean can’t comprehend if he didn’t have Sam.
From there Dean gives Sam his blessing to keep living his life. “I love you so much, my baby brother”.
Sam’s reaction was pure and raw, he has always been honest about his wants and needs but craves Dean’s approval to pursue them, and now he has it. Sam’s faith in Dean went answered with Dean saying how proud he is of Sam, how much he admired Sam’s strength so that Sam knows he is strong enough to go on living without Dean.
Another reason why the barn scene is genius is the pilot callback sets up Sam and Dean’s reunion heaven as pilot 2.0. From there they will build their relationship just as Sam and Dean. They are at peace without monsters disrupting their lives, vindictive angels disrupting their after-lives, or childhood angsts weighing them down. They have both freedom and peace.
How are you doing? What did you think about the final?
fam, I’m doing fuckin great.
Like-- okay, I’m just gonna ramble.
A while back I made a really bitter post about how, for me, Supernatural was already over. It’s no secret I think that I’ve found the Dabb years... trying. Individual things were fine but it seemed like the grasp of how stories are built and arcs handled and themes threaded through all of that had completely gone out the window. That, to be clear, I still think is true--there’s a way in which the thing that made SPN itself cracked in two, maybe somewhere in like... s12 or s13, and it never really recovered. I was so eager/relieved when they announced that they were ending with s15 because I thought -- oh, thank god, at least they’ll have a real endpoint to work towards. Then, s15 started happening, and it was so amateurish and terrible that I just stopped watching because frankly it was just a form of self-harm. I kept up with gifs, but that’s about it.
Last night, I went and dug up something I’d said a while back in our discord:
I was right about the first part -- and I’m so, so happy to have been wrong about the last part.
The thing about writing is that you have to make choices. A lot of what the Dabb Era has been is a lack of choices. Kill someone off but immediately bring them back; strip sacrifice of meaning; try to have your cake and eat it too. I’ve gotten actually-angry about it, to the point that I had to like step back and regain perspective about how this is a low-rent sci-fi show on the CW. But writing’s important to me, as a craft, and I couldn’t understand how it was going so badly.
The best thing about finales is that those choices are real. No matter what--there’s an ending, and this is the only ending it’s gonna be. With most shows/movies, this is fine--you watch it, you’re done, you move on. With rabid fanbases this can go very badly, because the various too-invested factions have been writing the ending in their head for so long that the choice the writer makes--no matter what choice it is--will be wrong and bad and evil, because in contradicts their expectations. (Here I remember the phrase: those are very nice receipts, but you wrote them yourself.)
What was totally shocking to me last night, as I was watching live (for the first time ever, with SPN), was how strongly and clearly and completely Dabb was managing to nail this landing. He made a choice and he stuck to it, and it turned out that here was the show I’d been missing, all this time. Here was the SPN I thought about when I remembered Dark Side of the Moon, or All Hell Breaks Loose, or Head of a Pin. It was fully invested in the two main characters, and it was generous to them, and it was generous to us, all at the same time. And all those actual decisions were backed up with the most skill the crew has shown in yeeeeeaaaars -- from editing to camerawork to acting to lighting, everyone brought their absolute A-game, when it seemed like they’d been phoning it in all year. (Except The Wig. I feel like I could write a full essay about The Wig, but you know what, I love that wacky thing too.)
What’s further shocking to me, and absolutely kind, is how open the ending is, too. We have an unspecified length of time between 5.19 and 5.20, and we have no idea how many mornings might’ve been just like that one we got in their sweet domestic montage. Look at all the story you can fit into there. Dean got to be purely happy, before the end. Sam was, too. Everything about the barn scene, which is fodder for a billion fics. That kind, kind heaven, where you can make it what you need it to be to feel right. The opportunity for those who need it for Castiel to be free; the opportunity for those who need it to let Sam have another life. Hell, Sam basically had a reader-insert fic delivered in 5 minutes, and you can fit any interpretation at all into that. For a season about stories, it was pretty shittily delivered, but somehow the endcap was exactly what it needed to be: a gentle, kind way to say hey: this is our story, but you can make it what you need it to be. Like that line in Fan Fiction, all over again.
And then--that ending. All I needed. A bittersweet singing joy to it. I’m just being hammered all over again by--yeah. It was just kind. For that, it was just about perfect. I’m not interested in quibbling over details or fandomite wars, and tbh it’s been depressing as I find out who I need to unfollow or even block, but I’m glad. My show pulled it off, inexplicably, right at the end. Very Winchester of them. :)
All of this
Jack & Rose / Sam & Dean parallel for @magi2506
“In all the world, there is no heart for me like yours. In all the world, there is no love for you like mine.” – Maya Angelou
Finally watched the 15X20 and I just love the ending.
All these years Sam wants an apple pie life and he finally had and he left peacefully.
Then I saw his son has a Anti-possession symbols, I think the world still have monsters and Sam keeps helping other hunters. Or at least he told his son the Winchester’s journey.
About Dean dying, I think it is the best ending to Dean. Dean is not fit to normal life, He know he will die when he hunts. So he told Sam don’t reborn him.
If the story end in 15X19, I think it just a endless story. The boys will hunts until they die in somewhere. 15X20 is a farewell and the boys deserve a good place, a good ending.
Then don’t leave me. Don’t leave me.
Reading so much negativity is difficult. I feel sorry for many Jensen fans because the ones who liked the finale probably follow many blogs who are being very ugly about the whole thing. I just want anybody who is a Jensen/Dean fan to know that him ending up in heaven with his Baby, content and at peace, was something he earned and deserved. And Jensen did a fantastic job. His smile when he felt Sam appear in heaven will live in my heart forever.
Don’t let those that are so vocal in their unhappiness sap yours.
I’ll take the itty-bitty one. That’s a bad choice. You see this? This is quick. It’s clean. No muss, no fuss. You blink and you’re dead.
Just to be clear, Dean’s character development was:
Finally being able to ‘drop the act’ and the bravado for a moment, and be brutally honest about how much he loves his brother, look him in the eyes and tell him how proud of him he was, when he really needs to hear it. It was going from being a man who used humor to stop himself from talking and thinking about his heavy, deep, vulnerable feelings- into a man who was able to tell the brother that he loves more than anyone, who he tried to protect, how scared he had actually been, and how, despite all his jabs at him- he didn’t know how he could ever have lived without him. It’s in his saying “it’s always been you and me” without giving a shit how ‘chick flick’ it sounds.
He finally didn’t care. He didn’t hold back, he poured his heart out with the words that punctuated his actions, hell, his entire personality. He told Sam how much he meant to him without trying to do the ‘manly’ thing and downplay the gravity of that love.
Sam always thought he let Dean down, that Dean loved John more, that Dean would have been better off without him. Even if he was reasonably sure about Dean, Sam needed to hear this, and Dean needed to tell him before he died.
Character development is not:
Making out with your male friend even though you have literally always been straight.
I hope this clears it up. The finale was great for me, Dean was not written off to further Sam’s plot, Dean and Sam, their all consuming love and brotherhood WERE the plot.
They both died beautiful characters, and they finally got to be together where they belong. I’m still crying, but in a good way.
I had to gif that whole scene, you know, for science 😊
so how long do we think Sam held Dean's body in that barn before he could even begin to think about moving him
How many times did he pray, consider a spell, anything to get Dean back, and how many times did he talk himself out of it
please, take my heart and go, now :’(
also we know he gave dean a hunter's funeral but how long did that take? twelve hours? several days? burning his body meant at least trying to begin to move on but how many hours did he contemplate making a selfish choice?
And afterwards - how many days, how many times, did he think about blowing his brains out? Throwing himself into a hunt hoping to die? Even as he moved on, even with a wife and child and new family and new purpose - how often did he go out and sit in that car, and cry, and think about driving off a cliff, into a lake - sick of crying, tired of waiting, just wanting to get to where he was supposed to be?
